The Most Aggressive Defense Of Teachers You'll Hear This Year

He is just like the UNION teachers..that do not want to really work!!

But they haven’t seen our teachers…who don’t care

>>He is just like the UNION teachers..that do not want to really work!!nnI dunno. He seems like he’s just like a union worker who stands up for his rights and the rights of his co-workers to make a decent living, to strive for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.nnHe strikes me as unlike someone who just rolls over for whatever scraps his employer is willing toss his way..nnAmerica is built on passion and strength and justice, not on servile surrender.nnThat’s how he strikes me.

WOW! RIGHT ON, DUDE! THANK YOU!

WOW! RIGHT ON, DUDE! THANK YOU!

For those commentors who are remarking on the unions or the teachers who don’t care, either you didn’t watch the video at all or missed the point entirely. It’s not about the unions, who by the way, protect the rights of such dedicated, passionate and absolutely essential public workers such as teachers, police, firefighters, etc. and it’s not about those teachers who simply don’t give a damn but are by far a minority in the educational system and not the majority.nnYes, as with any industry or vocation, from politics to unions; private to the public sector, there will always be those who attempt to game and take advantage of the system as that is unfortunately an inherent flaw in human nature, but let’s not let the minority define the majority and keep it all in its proper perspective.

You must have had some shitty teachers growing up, or is there some other reason you are so ignorant?

I’ve said it before and I’ll never stop saying it; I have learned more from teachers in WIsconsin–simply by being a parent of students, a classroom volunteer, and a student at a technical college, than I have learned anywhere else in my life or from anyone else. I am daily and eternally grateful for the wonderful teachers in my life.

i totally agree with mr. mali’s viewpoint. teachers are amazing public servants that work hard for the compensation they receive. unfortunately, the respect i have for his position is overshadowed by his disrespect for the dinner guest and his audience. 1. civil adults have discussions and loose credibility when they use vulgarity. 2. he reacted with the same disrespect that he was shown. 3. his passion and energy could be applauded if not for the belligerent tone of his passion.nthis is how teachers and other public school employees get a bad reputation for being bitter and elitist.

What teachers “make” in terms of salary varies widely across the country. In Texas, a “right to work state”, we have no unions but rather teacher/educator associations. These associations do influence salary negotiations but there is no striking or work stoppages of any kind. In general a Texas teacher will make anywhere from 10-20 thousand a year less depending on number of degrees and years in the classroom than say a teacher in a union state. Add in all the federal and state mandates we must follow, regional issues – in Texas urban areas you must also be certified to teach limited English proficient students to instruct the immigrant populations – and we spend many weekends and much of our summer in trainings or getting advanced degrees, at our own expense. I think there is a portion of the public that is not aware of the changes in public education in the last 25 years. To them I say, study the latest census information including immigrant populations, divorce rates, single parent families and the shift from a manufacturing base for jobs to lower paying service industry jobs for parents. Teachers don’t just teach their students. We are now expected to have a significant role in “raising” them as well. My students eat breakfast and lunch at school and then stay after school until 6:00pm for the after school program, I went to public schools myself and that experience doesn’t mirror todays reality.

Passionate, but too late.nnTechnology like Khan’s Academy will transform how the newer generations learn. The hit-or-miss quality of public education will no longer be determined by the presence of teachers who clearly give a fuck. Education in the future will be 100% interest-driven without a state-ordained structure simply because the Internet makes information liquid.nnAgain, I must point out that anyone who defended the unions when we were shipping manufacturing jobs overseas over the last 40 something years was called a racist, southern hick pro-nationalist klansmen who was causing people overseas to starve by not giving up our abundant wealth for them.nnIf required, that specter will be dragged out of the closet again. Regardless of abusive guilt mechanisms, technology is coming and all of this glorious stancing won’t mean a thing. Embrace the Information Age, people! Everything we’re told to cherish as of late is actually fungible.

Repost :X

Hardest. Job. Ever. Taught high school. Lowest pay, more hours than any other job in either private or public sector. Anyone criticizing teachers: you would not last a week in my classroom.

You ever been in the classrooom? It’s not an easy job. I was there for 30 years and retired — it’s too hard on the body. nAnd in all those years I saw maybe two or three — out of hundreds I worked with — who I would say “didn’t want to work”. They made our jobs infinitely harder.

I made graduate students learn research methods at 8am this morning, the morning after St. Patrick’s Day. And they liked it. :)

Please post a transcript for those who cannot hear/understand the video. Thank you!

God bless teachers. My daughter went to public school and had the best teachers ever. She now has a BA from Harvard, MA from Chicago. Most of her h.s. class went to Ivy League. She’s still friends with a lot of her teachers. Yet, there are still parents who criticized these same teachers as lazy, overpaid and incompetent. Teachers, for the most part, are very good—if you do your part as parents too.

Excellent.

I don’t think you understand that in addition to being an aggressively passionate teacher that gets invited to dinner parties with apparently obnoxious and condescending lawyers, he is also a slam poet that was filmed performing at a slam poetry event. I’m sure he is more than capable of serving it up with civility, but this was not an event where folks were expecting those virtues to be applied… and we weren’t shown a video from the dinner party to verify what tone he actually used that evening.nnWhile I would still probably disagree with you, perhaps your prudish condescension would have been better directed at MoveOn for promoting the merit of this performance without properly prefacing the context.

although i support unions and for all jobs to be paid well with good benefits, and it is harder and harder to find such jobs anymore, teachers come in all sizes and shapes, meaning not all teachers are good. i cannot name one teacher that stood out during my son’s time in school. in fact i can say more about the bad teachers, one example was his 8th grade math teacher who refused to teach while they were in negotiations for a new contract. instead he played with a remote control car and drove between the seats from his desk, while a student stood in front of the class to give the days lesson. yes, i made an official complaint. neither the administration nor the teachers liked me very much because i was always there. this same teacher halted all after school hours for students to ask him questions. this is just one of many… many problems i ran into with teachers. i don’t put them on a pedestal, each teacher must show me they are worth their salt.

This was awesome. I don’t like MoveOn, but this was awesome.

>> Education in the future will be 100% interest-driven … because the Internet makes information liquid.nninterest driven? or access driven? make use of that liquid information and tell me what percentage of american children don’t own a computer.

F*ck Yeah is all I have to say! That’s how to tell it like it is!!

Had great teachers here in the Midwest that WERE NON-UNION, and really worked. Not like the lazy ones were seeing now, that just want a check for 9 mos. and that is it…Great Public Education paid for by parents having to pay high property taxes…Not really ignorant, just very aware how lazy UNION TEACHERS are…..they know that they do not have to DO ANYTHING, but show up….if asked to work they call the UNION office and cry. “They want me to work”.”Our contract says just show up”. Good luck Rachel, in the real world…

Were you UNION??? nnThe Taxpayer..paid the most in for your benefits that your still enjoying correct???

Most UNION teachers do not care…want a check, the school system to pay all there benefits….be like the rest of the world and pay for your benefits…..

Top drawer! This guy should be syndicated nationally in the US.

YES, Rosie, the teachers are not a God’s because there a teacher….sounds like a very UNION teacher there in the 8th grade…our districts are so full of these TEACHERS that do not want to work….

Did you have a UNION contract?? You knew you were covered by your UNION contract and could not be “let go” for being lazy…just showed up for your 9 mos right??/

LOVE it, and I am not even a teacher.. but I had many that absolutely DID make a difference in my life!

So…. why can’t Texas teachers do anything about the lies and misinformation and historically inaccurate information in your textbooks? No wonder Texans grow up the way the do!

If every student could have at least one teacher who gave a damn like this guy, truly, no child would be left behind. Unfortunately, that’s not the case, and it’s not entirely the union’s fault. I’ve had teachers who didn’t belong in that profession, and I’m sure there are those who can say that about some their colleagues. To those who actually care about the students, who put up with students who don’t want to learn and parents who don’t care either, as well as administrators who may not know how to run a school I salute you.

Some of them are. I realize most people who chose teaching as a career are the most wonderful, magnanimous individuals out there, but every barrel has rotten fruit.

He is standing up for his right to discipline his students and make them learn. The guy gives a crap. Brovo, Mr. Mali.

because we don’t write the textbooks and guess what? Good teachers don’t use the textbook as the word of GOD. It’s a resource, so if the information is wrong, DON’T USE THAT PART!!! I am Texan, born and raised. I love my kids and husband, work hard at my job and raising young men you would be proud to have your daughter marry, stay true to my family and my country, save more than I spend, plan for my kids’ education, work toward funding my own retirement, I donate to charities, and speak up when I see injustice. So you tell me, what’s wrong with the way Texans grow up?

I would love to know how you treat your nurses, police officers, and firefighters. God forbid something happens and you have to have someone in a “UNION!!!!” help you. How many of those people would you call lazy? Just looking to get a check from the state and play all year?nnThe issues isn’t evaluating teachers, it’s evaluating the system. What is on the table now is firing teachers whose students don’t preform to the standards and cutting the funding to underperforming schools… which mainly means that the poor districts get even less funding when they don’t meet the standards. And the teachers that work there get fired because they just cannot compete with the already disadvantaged system. How are you hoping to evaluate teachers? Because firing them when the students don’t “preform well on tests” seems like a pretty broad and dangerously under thought idea. What you are suggesting leads which hunts in underprivileged areas and to the privatization of education.

This is disgusting. All that boasting about what he u201cmakesu201d the kids do, and his study hall sounds like the mess hall at a penitentiary. The kids donu2019t have a choice whether they are there or not, and here they are trapped with a shouting maniac who actually froths at the mouth, teaching them the nifty lesson that the loudest voice in the room combined with punitive authority gets to force his will on everybody else. A talented teacher gets willing and enthusiastic cooperation, a motivated student learns on their own, you cannot stop them. This guy clearly enjoys indulging in threats and bullying, and has the arrogance to brag about it. This is going to get the best out of a student? Along with his obvious enthusiasm for physical violence to get what he wants, he comes across as a fascist bastard with big control issues. Exactly the sort of teacher who would be fired if the parents had a say in who was allowed to teach their kids. But as Judge H. Walter Croskey noted in his ruling, a primary purpose of public schools is to indoctrinate kids to obey state authority, and to hell with the parents. And this guy implies the same with his clear contempt for parents.

So that small minority of ‘bad’ teachers has caused the universally bad decline in quality of education for American kids compared to the rest of the world?nnAnd remember collective bargaining is not a right. It is granted by law and can be taken away by new law.

i think its funny how you all assume so much about this video. this is an old slam poetry video that came out before all this union debate. check him out on you-tube. idk if he is union or not. i do know he teaches in a PRIVATE school. i would like to hear his opinions about the union busting but i think i have a good ideannregardless, you union busting right wingers need to lay off the teachers! nobody works as hard for such little respect! wake up! fox news is lying to you!

You are insulting my family. Many times growing up I saw my stepmum in particular work late into the night grading student projects, counselling students, and generally busting her ass for her kids in an underserved West Virginia county. She was paid for none of this extra time.nnShe became very ill because of unabated asbestos in the school building and yes, the UNION got us some money which she had earned at the cost of her health and hard work.nnShe is over 70 now and her former students still remember her fondly, some of them are still part of her life.nnMost teachers are like this. Dude, if you want to make a bunch of money, you don’t major in education. They tell you this in college. I myself ended up as an administrative assistant because I can’t live on what they’ll pay me teaching history and manage to eat, pay off my student loans and have some fun. It’s a hard life, it’s not for everyone, and you work many more hours than you’re paid for.

I teach high school art. I love what I do. I have always loved what I do. There has NEVER been anything else that I EVER what to do than be an art teacher. This guy makes me want to march. This guy makes me want to wave flags and scream our importance. Oh! My brother. Testify!

I am married to a teacher, and grew up in a family of passionate educators who have worked in both union and non union states. nnIt is inaccurate to state that union teachers do not want to work. There are excellent teachers in union and non union states, just as there are terrible teachers in union and non union states. Making a blanket statement like that is a disservice to the skilled educators who are in the profession because they care, to say there are none in union states is simply false. nnI know through interactions with my spouse’s co-workers that yes, there are teachers who thought it would be easy and just want a check. However, they are not the majority. There are many teachers who genuinely care about the future of their students, and their students’ education. They stay late, devote weekends and evenings to planning, sponsor extra curricular events on their own time, keep in touch with their students long after graduation, and pay much out of their own pocket. They are invested, and believe me, it’s not an easy job. nnThe unions can be a double edged sword, but they were formed for a reason. I do think protection of some sort should be in place for teachers, as education is frequently the first area of state and federal budgets to be cut. Teachers need to make a living wage. Now, many do, but I have friends who started their teaching careers making $26,000. That’s far too low for the service they were providing, but they took the job because they were passionate about teaching. They are professionals, and should be compensated as such. nnIf we had competent educators to begin with, would we complain as much about the unions? I think we need to ask the question: When did teaching become the fall-back career choice? nnI work in a university setting, and I find that the standards at the higher ed level are too low. If we demanded higher standards from our college students training to become teachers, we would likely have better educators to begin with. In the university setting, I am at times appalled to see what passes as coursework for those choosing to teach as a career. There is a great deal of busy work and box checking. While my husband earned his teaching degree, we were shocked by what received passing grades, let alone A’s from some of his peers. It’s a multi-faceted problem, but I think it would be wise to look to the source of our teachers, and re-evaluate their training. Perhaps then we could filter out those who aren’t teaching for the right reasons.

Sad that to my knowledge there are few teachers like Taylor. I just sat with one in a meeting to discuss my grand daughters special education plan and all she did was contribute a complaint over class size, three times, in case we missed it. Her class size is smaller than when I went to school, and her total compensation is about triple what I make. Teachers like Taylor probably don’t need union protection, but the majority know they need it, because they would be fired if judged on job performance.

Firefighters are union. Police are union. I don’t know a whole lot of lazy firefighters, or police for that matter. Union decidedly does NOT mean “paid for just showing up”; it means “getting reimbursed semi-adequately for all your hard work.”nnNobody enters teaching expecting it to be cushy and well-paid. You’d do better and have a lot less stress in an office job.

I clicked “Like” by accident. I do NOT like your comment, dahender.nnMost of the blame for the decline is the quality of education can be traced not to the teachers, but to the misguided voters (including parents) who are not willing to pay what must be paid to maintain good education.nnAnd those same parents don’t spend any time with their children, checking that they are doing homework or encouraging them to do anything other than play video games or surf the web.nnIt’s not the teachers’ fault, it’s OUR fault – all of us – for letting our own needs get in front of the needs of the society we live in.

Heylookingfor: Remember the words of honest Abe – nn”Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.” nnIzzy never mentioned whether he was union or non-union and nothing in the post indicated he was lazy. At least try to make relevant comments.

Quality education is not solely the province of teachers; it involves parents, administrators, and the kids themselves. It does not contribute to the quality of education when parents don’t make their kids do their homework, insist on “social promotions,” and, when the kid gets a bad grade or acts up in class, insist that it’s ALL the teacher’s fault. Nor does it help when administrators cave to parents rather than backing up teachers who are trying to do a good job.

So why is PUBLIC education so poor across the nation? Is it because of a ‘few’ lazy UNION TEACHERS…most likely!!

No. The increased class sizes, the out of date textbooks, the low pay for teachers that drives talent out of the market, the disrespect, the right wing nuts who want to have teachers teach religion rather than science. I could go on and on. But that’s a start to why we rate below other countries. nnCollective bargaining, which tries to protect good teachers from even more arbitrary and mean spirited political cheap shots is the least of it.

No. Excessive management of teachers by people who have never been in a classroom and have no idea what they’re talking about has helped cause this disaster of an education system. “Teaching to the test” because you’ll lose your job if you don’t has helped causes this disaster. Parents who raise the rudest children imaginable — kids who simply do not know how to behave in public have helped cause this disaster of an education system. A society that takes naturally curious kids and somehow turns them into people who don’t want to learn causes a lot of this disaster. And yes, lack of funding so the books are old and there are no supplies except what the teacher pays for out of his/her pocket has helped caused this disaster. I know. I’m a college professor and I see the results of this disaster in our incoming freshmen every year. But I don’t blame it on the teachers. Give them what research has proved works — small classroom sizes. Give them the supplies they need. Remove the fear of losing your job if some percentage of the kids don’t pass some test created by someone who has never dealt with kids. Give them the authority to send kids to the principal’s office to *live* if they have to, without the parents calling to complain. If you give teachers the kind of work environment in which they can realistically be expected to produce the results we all want, then let the ones that don’t go ahead and change careers.

And one more thing . . . I used to teach educators at the grad school level and the people going into educational administration were always the worst students in the class. That ought to tell you something.

One more comment. I used to teach educators at the grad school level. I could always tell the ones who were going into administration — they were the worst students in the room. That ought to tell you something.

Please leave the Ivory Tower of education and look at the difference between a UNION teacher and private education, or the quality of the education that is taught by the lazy Union teachers..HUGE…the union has made them lazy in knowing they can’t be fired etc….nnPlease leave the liberal “Ivory Tower of Education”.

Kobe Bryant? LeBron James? Peyton and Eli Manning? You have no worth. Any worth you have is owed to a TEACHER. You play kid’s games for obscene amounts of money. Forfeiting all of professional athlete’s ridiculous salaries for 2 years would pay a HUGE portion of our debt. America, we need to get our priorities in order. We want to fix the world, but have no idea how to fix US!

Because people don’t support it and then bitch that it’s crappy.

And I don’t GET THE CAPS. You do know how to properly construct a sentence don’t you?

You’re not a teacher and never have been one, right?

It also involves communities and investment and belief in education. We devalue education in this country, where being smart is equated with being “elite,” which is thought a bad thing.

In your statement of firing the teachers that do not teach students to take these tests, and pass…what is really wrong with firing that lazy UNION or NON-UNION teacher??? So , you like your property taxes going to the non-working teacher?? Because we all pay those taxes for an education to our young….

I guess as a liberal you just don’t get it. There are too many horrible teachers out there that could care less about doing a good job and they hide behind their union to keep their job. Both my parent were educators and they were dedicated teachers to their students. They also had the good sense to know that there were many bad teachers that deserved to lose their job but could not be removed because of the union. Unions are destroying America with their own greed. Get a clue!

Oh really…..how do unions protect professions we naturally need? Gees are you saying teachers, police, firefighters, etc. would be treated as slaves if there were no unions? I agree since unions are such a small percentage compared to the private sector let’s not let the minority define the majority and keep it all in its proper perspective.

Why is that people oppose collective bargaining for workers, but seem to just loooove the power of corporations to control the way our country is run? The chamber of commerce is nothing more than a collective of businesses lobbying for what they want. Why shouldn’t workers have the same ability and right to collectively bargain for what they want? Why is trying to make more money and have better benefits and a better life a bad thing? It’s the American dream, but workers are supposed to forego that and live at the mercy and whim of the employer?nnBefore unions, there were no weekends, no 40 hour work weeks, no sick leave, no vacation pay because workers had no power and the companies had it all and could impose any kind of work conditions they chose. I don’t understand why anyone other than a corporatist would want to return to that time.

Please leave the right-wing tower of ideological political correctness. My bet is you, personally, have never worked as hard as the worst teacher.

But we don’t define every other profession by the few who are bad. Right now politicians are trying to pin all the blame for the economy and schools on teachers, and sadly, too many people are willing to play along and be duped. Yeah, let’s keep the peons fighting for crumbs instead of looking at who is really benefitting the most.

SOUNDS GREAT….LOVE PEOPLE FROM TEXAS…THERE SO AWARE OF ALL THE PROBLEMS….

I agree but its too bad us tax payers have to pay such expensive public pensions because our education system would never be underfunded.nnAlso let’s cut out the PC crap and let the teachers discipline these disrespectful kids once again without fear of being sued by their ignorant and arrogant parents.

You keep saying this, but have absolutely nothing to back it up. If you want to know how to back up your opinion, ask a teacher.

lol…..low pay….lol……that’s a good one. I’m a conservative but I do not want religion taught in school. That’s a personal choice. I also don’t want an atheist like you teaching my kid the only way is the unbelieving science way either.nnWe rate below other countries because our education system is more concerned with being PC than what is right for a particular individual. Plus thank the unions for protecting lousy teachers.

Great post!

I’ve heard this speech years ago, or possibly read it in written form.nI really don’t know what percentage of teachers are truly poor, butnI can remember only two that actually inspired me. One teacherndid this by accepting nothing less than my best. Another by teachingnme that computers do not always do what we expect them to do.n(I’m a computer programmer who started learning at the start of the development of the concept of people owning personal computers.)nnFor the rest of my teachers, I can remember more than a few thatnI knew were just marking time. It did not matter that much to menat the time. I got my A and B grades with little effort. I minded laternbecause it left me unprepared to compete against others who werenat or above my level.nnThe problem is, there is really no obvious fair metric to judge anteacher without actually dwelling in the classroom for the entirenyear. The lack of this makes it hard to know who to keep andnwho should go. Students know who motive them and if you havena large enough group you might find out, but by then the damagenhas often already been done.nnThe complaints people have are legitimate when it comes to ncompensation. Teachers do happen to get a lot of vacation time, atnleast for those with standard school years. They also have tenure,nbut I’m at a loss at why they do or any union job should be “safe”nbased on seniority rather than skill set.nnMore than half of the California state budget is going to the school systems, yet there is a graduation rate of less than 50%. Something here is definitely wrong. I don’t know the exact percentage of that isngoing to compensate the teachers, but from what I have read, it is bynfar the lion’s share.nnWe are building schools in areas where the population of children isndropping. They convince the voters its for the children, but is it really?nnThe teachers like to say that on average the pension is only aboutn26K. The problem is, that includes early retirees. What I’d really likento see is the average lifetime total COST of each teacher of their pensions and other benefits. I’d like to see it for each group, whethernit is police, fire, or garbage collector.nnThe money is not there any more because they have hired too manynpeople to do work that someone though would be nice to have, butndid not consider the long term cost/benefit of it and now we have nonchoice but to make adjustments because people who are alreadynpaying high taxes and receiving little in the way of services are lessnthan inclined to do so, especially if it is to reward people with benefitsnthat they themselves do not enjoy.nnI pay teachers respect, but I see no reason to blindly hand over mynwallet.n

ive been to austin and dallas! i loved it out therennbut texas orders more text books than any other state so the people who make schoolbooks go off of what texas wants. was all over the news a few months ago, google it if you want tonnbut regardless much love to texas

Oh, right. The out of control pensions are just a figure of our imaginations. Where did you learn math? Oh that’s right……liberals are unconcerned with economical facts. Money just falls from the sky huh? I guess if your Ben Bernanke it actually does.

Some major hurf durrrrr UNION BAAAAAAD bleeting here.

Yeah right…America is built on passion and strength and justice, not on servile surrender. It certainly didn’t get there because of unions. nnStriving for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is an individual right NOT a union’s right!

That could not be removed because… Unions?nnOr because they knew how to cover up their tracks and shmooze the parents and principal?nnDo you know the difference, or even what ‘liberal’ means?

What decline? Citation.

Is Nanci Little a liberal?

If you don’t want someone of another religion teaching your child, you have that option.nnHowever, this is the US of A. You don’t have the option of discriminating against people of other religions or lack thereof.nnAtheist isn’t a slur, and Roy didn’t say he was, either. So why’d you use it as a slur?

he works for a private school so parents DO have a say in their teachers. check out his videos and you’ll soon realize he is a great teacher (my assumptions of course, ive never met the man) and sometimes you have teachers who you cant stand but by the time you are older you understand and appreciate them so much and you wish you would have realized it when you were younger

Yes.nnUnions are a small percentage because of people like you who hurl slurs and don’t know the history of workers’ rights.

They also don’t cite any overall loss in education of the populace, either.nnFifty years ago our public schools didn’t even try to educate a large portion of the populace. What, kids who were non-whine, non-urban, non-upper class didn’t count when we didn’t have schools for them?

If you’re handed a poor tool to do the job… Your reaction is to blame the person given the wrong tool?nnWhat?

I have been teaching in a community college for seventeen years. I taught at a private college for three years before that and as a TA and adjunct for five years before that. With any luck I will retire in thirteen years and my fat pension will be about $19, 000 a year. I love my job and would never want to do anything else. But you people who think that we’re the problem need to take a look at the Wall Streets and Enrons of the workld, not us.

What was your point?nnThat a teacher should still teach when they’re not paid? Why?

What’s wrong with the union, per se?nnDo you have a point, or just vitriol?nn’Cause you keep saying they’re lazy, but I don’t see a citation. And I’m not sure what it has to do with the mention of other unions in the post you’re replying to.

Their, there and they’re are homophones. I learned this from a public educator. Is is? Children is not a proper noun. I don’t even know where to start with the semantics of the last sentence.

Do states with union teachers do worse, somehow? I’m not sure what the basis for your point is.

The supreme court did make it a corporation’s right.

Yeah KenM and I’m sure you’re that type of pathetic parent that would whine and cry that your kid was actually disciplined by a teacher who actually cared more about your kid’s future than you do. nnI wish my kids had this type of teacher way more than the worthless PC teachers they were stuck with. Oh, the poor little children are such victims huh KenH?

Some? Most! Yes, there are bad teachers, but why are *all* teachers tarred with that brush?

Back when you had some giant class size they probably sent special education kids to a basement and could use real punishment on behavioral issues in the office, rather than the gentle reminders teachers are limited to now. The teacher probably taught one way to the whole class and didn’t have to modify much curricula.

Every job has rotten fruit. (Just as yours does).n

Many years ago I met with a mother of one of my students during parent-teacher sessions. It happened to be a “snow day”, where school was canceled, but teachers had to report, driving through snow drifts to get to school. So, mom and I spent 5 minutes talking about academics and 10 minutes on how to get her son to shovel her driveway. Asked mom, “How do I get my son to shovel our driveway ? He got up this morning and started to shovel neighbors’ driveways for pay.” “What? I thought. Five minutes on academics and ten minutes advising/counseling mom on how to get her son to do a favor for mom. I’m guessing these examples have multiplied over the past 35 years. After 4 years of teaching high school, I had to move on to college administration. Subsequently, I have always held public and private school teachers in high regard.

First of all, not all teachers are union members. I live in Florida, and we choose whether to be in unions or not. Some teachers (in other states) don’t have a choice. Just because I’m not a member does not mean that I don’t think others have a right to be union. I am sick and tired of corporate running our world and feeling that the little guy deserves nothing. Generally, the little guy works his butt off for nothing. Unions can be very important if run correctly. There, in itself lies the problem, but that does not mean that they should cease to exist. Cesar Chavez started union rights for farmers because of mistreatment. Everybody complains that the government is trying to take our rights, but this truly is an infringement. I definitely think that it should be much easier to get rid of bad teachers. I know one or two in our school, but most work hard all weekend to do what is needed for our schools. I plan on doing some more work as soon as I get off of here, and that can be typical on a Friday. I’m very tired of being lumped in with lazy teachers as they put it, and I’m pretty sure what Taylor Malin had to say goes double for me!!

When it comes to his joy of creating victims, think of this, noted on the video. A student comes up to him to ask permission to use the bathroom – The Big Bully replies that the student doesn’t need to use the bathroom, the student is just bored. After calling the kid a liar – and it sounds like in front of the whole study hall, where he can revel in the kid’s humiliation – do you suppose the student went back to their seat chomping at the bit to “learn”. To rephrase the question, was his action helpful in steering the kid to new and valuable information?

Where the hell do you get off saying that utter B.S… He never said he was an atheist, but as an atheist myself, I am really annoyed. You don’t have to be atheist to think religion in school is ******* stupid. You’re also an ignorant prick for calling science ‘unbelieving’. SCIENCE AND RELIGION ARE NOT THE SAME! STOP CLASHING THEM, IDIOTS. Science is how things work, religion is what you believe, THEY ARE NOT THE SAME.nnSo tired of this mainly Christian ego that keeps spouting B.S. like this.

You’re laughing at $55,000 after 27 years with a Master’s Degree? Please! You must be blue collar. I spent a lot of money for six years of college and knew that I wouldn’t make much, but I never dreamed the amount of work, time, etc. that actually went into the job. My brother use to feel the same way as you until he decided to teach. Let me offer you the same opportunity. Now that he’s in the classroom, he actually has a right to talk. Funny, his tune has changed. I invite you to spend a year in my classroom (even a week) and then do your little song and dance about how well paid we are. You, my sir, are a joke!!

Do you even know what a liberal is?

A slur? Then you must be an insecure atheist to interpret it as a slur. nnSimple deduction Crissa. If he wants science taught versus his criticism of religion then its stands that he mostly likely he does not believe in a God of any kind.

Here we go with slurs again. You poor little pathetic worker. nnYour ignorance comes from a position of never being educated or courageous enough to think on your own and run your own business. nnYour reply makes no sense at all.

I wish I could shake his hand for someone finally being honest about what a teacher does and is!!!!

Duh my parents began educating public school children in the 1940′s. Duh that was 70 years ago. The vast majority were poor kids in unpopulated areas.nnReally Crissa how stupid are you? How did you learn to read?

I don’t see where I typed corporation. I believe I typed union…no?

KenM it appears you must have fallen into making yourself your own victim as well. I guess the kid wouldn’t have learned too much in the bathroom either huh?nnSounds like you were one of those excuse making bored kids.

No Crissa he’s saying lazy people like yourself should not have a job since they really don’t want to work.

Try not to use big words Crissa. They make you look dumber than you already look.

Of course you wouldn’t get it. You poor soul.

Let me explain something from the trenches for all you stubborn conservatives and ignorant liberals out there who think that either unions are the problem or the solution. nnTo the liberals….nNewsFlash: UNIONS are not worth their dues! The truth is many teachers would not even join if given a choice because they know that their local union does little for them. nnTo the conservatives….nUNIONS are NOT responsible for hiring and retaining under-qualified, lazy teachers; HR and ADMINISTRATION are responsible. Don’t kid yourselves….even in our noble democratic system we have people who continually hire their sisters, brothers, cousins, nieces, friends and who give them cushy jobs in local high schools where chances are these teachers were once C level students. It is these very people who RUN the schools and who perpetuate mediocrity.nnUnions, especially teacher unions, have little power in actually directing what goes on in schools today. nnUnfortunately good teachers are on their own (and I AM CONVINCED that MOST teachers are good). nnGood teachers have been:n1. abandon by an American public that doesn’t respect themn2. criticized by enabling parents for asking too much n3. targeted by a federal government that is looking to shift the blame n after years of negligent fundingn4. despised by the local education establishment (i.e. the status quo n cesspool) nnWake up America and smell the corruption.nnYour teachers need your support and if you don’t realize that, then I fear that you are only going to drive the best of us out of this profession.nn

I’d like to know how all the politicians learned to be politicians and how they can sleep at night realizing they not only are attacking the profession which SHOULD be the most prized in the nation but those people who are responsible for their childrens future. Or , are their children all in exclusive private schools and will rely on the good ole boy network to move ahead in the world. I believe we need to look at the educational system in this country more like a corporation with rewards for a job well done. I have to take more classes and do more internships as a horse show judge and riding coach than I did to become a substitute teacher. What does that say about the educational system in this country?

Funny how you spend all your time trying to figure out what I am. The question raised was what he is, and it’s not a good teacher. So, to get an intelligent answer out of you, solve the following pedagogic problem: “A student asks to use the bathroom, but you suspect he’s actually bored. Phrase an answer to the students request that will determine the students true needs. If it turns out the student is just bored, you can earn extra credit by outlining a creative response that is respectful, helpful and motivational for the student” (I bet any answer you come up with will be better than what this jerk did)

Obviously you don’t. nnBut to answer your question. Yes, they could not be removed because of the protection of the union.

lol….I guess I was accurate based off your own atheist insecurities. nnHey dude, you obviously believe in evolution and not creation. My point, you atheist moron, is that I would not want my kid taught your atheist evolution theory. Its a theory not a fact!nnOh btw, does science believe in God? If not then I would say science is unbelieving….duh.nnAlso go try on the Science of Religion. You might actually learn something new.

Most teachers are not in a union.

I can’t stop watching this, I just love it! Makes me tear up thinking about all the teachers who made a difference in my life :)

There’s a reason the unions are needed to protect teachers. When someone’s precious little poopsie earns an F, their urge may be to blame the teacher, and not the student. Principals can be influenced by the right parent to let a teacher go. Unions can not. Teachers have a rough enough job without parasites like you trying to take down the unions that protect them.

KenH he’s simply a tough teacher that gives a damn. Sadly you cannot see his passion for what he does. Obviously, you seem like a guy that could easily be played by any student or kid.nnPedagogically speaking…that’s his style and its apparent you would rather have a passive wimpy educator to teach your kids.nnSo KenH please phrase an answer to the student’s request that would determine the student’s true need in that scenario?

In every profession, union and non union you will find good and bad employees and if they remain employed, it is because you have bad management.n If you somehow believe that union teachers are the only bad employees in the world then you need to take a step back and think about the reality of that thought process. You have been brainwashed. You need to ask yourself why someone is telling you that public teachers who are in unions are bad where there is absolute NO factual basis for this. None. nIf you think only private school teachers are decent, then you need to actually look up the facts of that and how they compare in testing, poverty, parental involvement and who the students are at a private school. You need to look at the attrition rate of inner city private schools who hand pick their students and still have a drop out rate that is similar to public schools.nLastly, if you think unions are bad, I suggest you research Finland- which has the modern educational system with consistently high test scores and notice that they are 100% unionized. nUnions are NOT the problem.Period.

So you can’t produce any facts to back up your claims. Why not just say that?

People like you are exactly the reason that we rate below other countries in education. Other countries teach SCIENCE. Tell you what – if you don’t want to believe in evolution, don’t take antibiotics ever again. They are formulated to treat bacteria that evolves from generation to generation.nnAnd, by the way, one can believe in evolution and God at the same time.

For a fascinating conversation redux, scroll through the comments and see which commenters’ posts are riddled with spelling/grammar errors, and then compare your results to their points. Enough said.

You realize that Citizens United includes Unions as “corporations” too. Seriously, did your teacher never teach you to research facts before you write something down and call it a fact?

You go man!!!!!!!!!!!! Hooray for YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!, and all the other teachers who make a difference!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Amen to that! Oh, wait a minute, that is a religious comment. Oops!

that’s the thing with WI. It didn’t eliminate Unions, it eliminated bargaining rights for anything but wages, made it not mandatory to be part of it or pay dues.

Guy writes a great speech, but he never answered the question. I’ve taught too. Teachers. Most arrogant, hardest to teach (unless they want to be) individuals, ever. And their union is equally arrogant. I’m all for making a buck, and for fair compensation, but the teachers’ unions take to heart the concept of asking for the moon and stars in a negotiation, but forget that that tactic is so that you’ll have some room to fall back into more comfortable territory.

In order to clarify a bit, I’ve had and had the privilege of knowing some great teachers. Truly great. But I’m sorry to say that I’ve had and known many more who were not.

SDTrader, you state below that evolution is “just a theory, not a fact.” As a biology teacher, I want to remind you that ‘theory’ has a different meaning in science than it does in day to day speech. In science, it means a group of principles that explain observations. Universal gravitation is ‘just a theory’ too–but I wouldn’t recommend you jump out a tenth story window to test it!

If you were in an IEP meeting that called for x minutes to be spent on something like say speech therapy and the school could not meet it because they had 25 kids per class and 12 classes per 1 speech therapist, wouldn’t you want to know this as a parent? A teacher cannot come out and say hey, we are not meeting the IEP goals, because there is usually an administrator there. However they can offer you clues and drop hints for you to ask questions that must be answered. n

“There are too many horrible teachers out there that could care less about doing a good job…”nnIf they could care less, does that mean they couldn’t care more about doing a good job?

and you complain about that?! An E-6, that spent 20 years defending YOUR freedom, gets less a year in retirement than you do…That’s IF he doesn’t die first. Quit complaining, you chose your profession, deal with the consequences of that decision.n

If you study the history of special education, you will see that until the passage of the Education for All Handicapped Children Act (the basis of IDEA) was enacted in 1975, the majority of children with disabilities were not educated in public schools, because schools were allowed to reject them. Now the local public school is considered the first placement option for students with even the most severe disabilities. I believe this is a noble goal, but I think it would be absurd to think this doesn’t impact average test scores. Incidentally, most countries that score higher than the US in education do not pursue a similar goal as far as educating children with disabilities.

Couldn’t answer yourself, huh. 1. Kid asks to use the bathroom. 2. Teacher replies “You need to use the bathroom?”, a respectful reply that indicates that I did hear his question, understood it, and gently queries him about necessity. 3. Kid replies “Yeah”. 4. Teacher replies “Go ahead and use it”,. both respectfully assuming the kid is telling the truth AND holding him accountable for doing so, but adds “try to be quick and report back to my desk when you’re done, and lets take a look at what you’re looking at”. That last part asserts not only interest in what the kid is doing, but provides the teacher with a venue to confirm or deny his suspicion that the kid is just bored. If the kid IS bored, next step, find out why. And for those who keep querying me about my job, I’m a cop.

I’m all for teacher’s rights, but this guy sounds like one of those bad teachers that ruins education for students who actually want to learn… forcing silence and solitude, and refusing to let kids go to the bathroom on assumptions.

Out of control pensions! Sorry pal. You have no clue what you are talking about. Not only is my teacher’s pension VERY modest, but rules about “double dipping” actually penalize those of us who are married to teachers. You seem to be just spewing misinformation!

Teachers are the most underpaid professionals in this country, and this country needs the best teachers and education desperately. Because we are in a global race and we’re falling behind and the competition is just heating up. Yes, bad teachers need to be weeded out, (we know a few) but 50K and benefits is hardly a fortune for the overwhelming majority who are dedicated to this thankless task.Some people out there in the current climate are so bent on punishing the bad teachers, but why don’t we treat the best ones like we do our athletes, lawyers, entertainers? Who are the real heroes here? Why don’t we take 3% of the insane defense budget create a Federal Teacher’s Corp and encourage the best and brightest to give at least 3-5 years of service? Why don’t we give bonus’, awards and parade the best teachers around town?n You want to talk about waste and bloat there are plenty of other places to look, but scapegoating teacher’s ( and fireman and police) unions is not helping anything, and is only creating an atmosphere that will drive away the best people from the noblest of professions. There has never been a time in our history when we needed them more.

Pay for there benefits instead of on the backs of taxpayers…that is what it comes back, to the UNION teachers not wanting to belly up like the rest of the working world, and pay for their benefits….they want to live off the taxpayer all there life….

Oh please, the whoa is me is getting old. It is being “pinned” on all of government. No nook or cranny is immune. Let’s face it, government and it’s services have become too burdensome. They are unsustainable and must be cut. Why is it just the teachers and their unions whining?

Izzy, is most likely a UNION member …by not answering we know that the lazy UNION blood is running there.. in the statement of the contract “in just showing up means a check”. Please open your eyes and watch the local UNIONS at work, or not working. Look at the UNION members on your street crews…please HOW MANY ARE STANDING AROUND looking at the hole, and wondering what to do next, or when the next break is??…Your telling me you have never seen that in your fair city, or with your state Highway crew???nnPlease look at the results from your local schools do you wondered if someone is teaching in the classrooms..Look?? The lazy…union..teachers inaction….or as you think doing there job!!!

plozar….UNION does mean n”paid for showing up”

May I add to the “fault” the families who do not provide proper prior-to-school learning experiences, including good vocabulary exposure in both conversation as well as literature? Students who arrive in Kindergarten and cannot even speak their OWN language as a 5 year old should, (let alone English if that is not their 1st language), have a very rough road ahead…as do the teachers who attempt to make up for what the parents didn’t do before age 5!

Absolutely the truth.

And maybe the student would have learned more in the bathroom! It’s an extreme example, but Einstein got his best insights while shaving! Maybe the student just needed the bathroom for solitude, which is impossible in a study hall, not necessarily to ponder whatever was assigned, but possibly whatever genuinely grabs the students interest. Under Mr. Know-It-All’s system above, you’ll never know what the student really needed because you didn’t bother to ask. Very few schools, public or private, provide places for solitude; but most real learning epiphanies happen while in solitude.

:-) You nailed him on one of my pet peeves! I am not worthy!

I’m not a teacher and I don’t belong in a union. Never considered being a teacher – the pay was too low. So I find it remarkable that the word “greed” is included in any criticism of teachers. My wife, my siblings, and several friends are teachers and am I jealous of their summers off and pensions? Damn right I am but why would I bash them for having something I don’t? Why are those criticizing teachers wanting to push them down instead of asking why they themselves can’t have have better job protections and better retirement plans? Why the desire to bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator?

Based on the numerous misspellings or grammatical errors in your comment, I have to guess that you are bitter about your own inability to succeed in school.

Curriculums are usually created/enacted/enforced by school boards…NOT TEACHERS. Teachers teach what they are told to teach…or lose their jobs.

Tiferet, was your mother in A UNION?? Most likely not she worked, and cared for her students!! Look at the lazy UNION teachers now…they could careless if the students make it…look at the nation educational system…..why do you think people are sending there kids to private school…for an education…not to have them babysat by a UNION teacher..living off the taxpayer….nnYour Mother did not work on the back of taxpayers….like these UNION teachers, that just show up for a check….and work maybe a 8 to 9 mos…So Miss Dudett,,,sorry your just Adm. Assistant..really a college loans are not required for that entry level job…byt it is your choice….

Based on the number of misspellings or grammatical errors in your reply, I must assume you are simply bitter due to your own lack of success in school.

Crissa, YES!! LOOK at the testing results…UNION teachers…are at the bottom of the educational level…unable to get employment….with out the UNION… Go to your state educational records…UNION teachers show up for the check on the 15th and 30th…and nothing in between….

The CAPS as you state…are for the IVORY TOWER PEOPLE..looking down on the poor working souls…..who are carrying their textbook theories out…but have no idea what life is about. Like the UNION teachers…who just show up for their check….because the MIGHTY UNION will protect there A** for just showing up to work or rather place of employment……

Does it strike anyone as odd…and foolish, that poor, middle class people are squabbling with other poor, middle class people? Rather than attacking the problem, agreeably, a bloated government, we turn on each other. What kind of sense does this make?

Learnufool, do you have employment?? Or are you living in a “IVORY TOWER” of education??? Just wondered if you had a real job…are you a UNION MEMBER???

Whoa /= woe…nThanks for proving more education is always helpful if you want to be taken seriously. I laughed..

Please…get over how wonderful Unions are…look at how they killed most if not all manf. jobs here in the USA…because of the very high wages required…by these Unions…

You must have had bad teachers, since your grammar skills are those of a 3rd grader.

The IVORY TOWER Democrat “itdepends…please get down from your very high level of education, and join the working world!!

lol…nice play on words……..but yes.

PLEASE>>>>the UNIONS are not influenced…what world do you live in ??? Show that UNION leader some cash….they will change there mind. An if poopsie makes an F…the lazy UNION teacher is not part of the problem???

MichaelB..The IVORY TOWER LIBERAL..if he even knows what that means…probably not…, but waiting on the UNION shop Steward to tell him what to do etc..

I also assumed they had some degree of knowledge about the rights they were referring to.

Getting a little unhinged there MichaelB?

So what is it, misspellings or grammatical errors Mr Perfect? Or did you mean misspellings and grammatical errors? A+ buddy!

Funny how all the commie/socialist union manufacturing jobs are all now primarily done by… wait for it… commies and socialists in China, Vietnam, etc.

Use an as the article before a word the begins with a vowel.

And the last time i looked, this country has been all volunteer since Vietnam. Hence, you E-6 who defends this country also chose his/her profession, just like the teachers that are teaching this nation’s children.

What pay and benefits do you think a public school teacher in Missouri gets when they retire. I’d like to hear what you know about it?

Troll much?

@seestraight also used “it’s” when he should have used “its.”

every day you are grading students papers meeting with parents. They deserve the time off. give them a break. then to add to i you are making lesson plans. some of them do after school activities.

The unions and tenure are the only protections a teacher has when they blow the whistle on problems in the school. Otherwise, their evaluations will be about being good little teachers who never speak up for the kids. However, as professionals they cannot put down the principal’s organizational skills at an IEP meeting. They can only give you the facts, such as the ones you were given. She was probably hoping you’d perk up and be vocal about the size issue that was hurting your child’s growth.

There’s good & bad in everything, but mostly unions are good & work for good people. If a few “bad apples”‘ get to take advantage, one can only attribute THAT to a society that celebrates the slicksters who get away with “it” like the wall st Banksters for instance.nWe the people of the United States in order to form a more perfect UNION…nThat’s how our Constitution starts!nThe USA is a better country because of unity in jobs, in patriotism & in ALL the ways we stay UNITED.nUnited we stand—–don’t like it?nFind a monarchy to live under & stop tearing down our UNION.

@Benny Hanna: Either.n@Heylookingfor: It’s steward.

There’s good & bad in everything, but mostly unions are good & work for good people. If a few “bad apples’ get to take advantage, one can only attribute THAT to a society that celebrates the slicksters who get away with “it” like the Wall St Banksters for instance.n”We the people of the United States in order to form a more perfect UNION…”nThat’s how our Constitution starts!nThe USA is a better country because of unity in jobs, in patriotism & in ALL the ways we stay UNITED.nUnited we stand—–don’t like it?nFind a monarchy to live under & stop tearing down our UNION.nShow some respect for teachers & your fellow citizens if you think that you are worthy to live in the great country that we have!

I am pro-teacher and union, but a teacher should never do such things during work hours. When you are working, you should be working you tail off, especially as a teacher. I do agree that when negotiations are heading down the tubes, a teacher should curtail their off-work hours at the building. This experience seemed extreme. nWhen this happened in my neighborhood school I saw teachers meeting with kids in the local library at night helping students with their work rather than at school.

Can you explain why the norther states where the teachers are unionized have better educational results than southern states with non-unionized teachers?

Duh? What are you, twelve?

As a chemistry teacher myself, I spend a couple of weeks educating students on the word theory in science compared to theory in their English classes. Normally don’t expect to educate adults in the same way. Maybe they are actually adolescents trolling on this site rather than doing their homework. Would account for the misuse of their/there/they’re that I have seen.n

You’re right! An E-6 should get better retirement benefits. I’m going to write my congressman and demand that military retirement benefits be increased substantially.

You are very economical with your facts.

Don’t believe it. At the very least you saw an exception to the American situation at that time. No way, no how. African-Americans in most areas were still fighting for any education. Many people never went to high school regardless of race in the 40′s.

Spelling, grammar, and math – these are just some of the basic skills that teachers impart to us. It is not “elite”, “liberal”, or “ivory tower” to expect and demand that all of us, as American tax payers, get a basic education. Spending money on education is an investment in the future. Not spending money on education is short sighted.

When and why are teachers disrespected and demonized? Why do we not deserve a decent salary? Why are we so terrible? nMaybe because we are stupid enough to work our asses off for other people’s children.

It might be more profitable to put all of that anger to the .1% of the population that earns 12% of the money in this country. Don’t you see they are pitting us against each other to distract us from the fact that they want public servants to pay for the cost of the financial bailout after which the CEOs now earn higher salaries?

If it weren’t for unions the good teachers wouldn’t earn enough to feed their families. Yes, there are teachers not doing a good enough job. There are processes outlined in contracts to let go of these teachers. My experience is that administrators do not do their jobs and use these processes.

Why are all the comments posted by teabaggers so illiterate? Why are their posts so consistently full of misspellings, poor grammar, and bad punctuation? Lack of intellect, bad genes, or bad teachers?

Amen Brother! The person below who commented that any teacher who could just show up and get paid has never set foot in a classroom! No teacher can Just show up!!! Before you say a word I challenge you to spend just one day in any public school and then see what you think! I’ve taught for 24 years and have never spent one day without teaching, mothering, or nurturing the kids in my class! If more parents did the job they were suppose to do when they decided to have kids our public school system would not be in the shape it is! Why is it that I am suppose to care more about your kid then you do?? It’s always someone elses fault!!

True enough, but the right wing is nothing if not short sighted. These are the guys who think that cutting the IRS budget will somehow result in more tax cheats being caught. These are the guys who think that outlawing contraceptives will reduce abortions. These are the guys who think any number of ridiculous things before breakfast.

This angry guy seems able to defend himself. So why does he need a union to fight his battles?

I don’t think that anyone who is acquainted with the situation believes that private school teachers are better on average than public school teachers. The private schools are in the business of making money and they aren’t about to hire someone with good credentials when they can get a cheaper model. Especially the religious schools are prone to look only at the person’s religious background and forget that they only have a high school or GED degree. At least public school teachers have college degrees and thanks to NCLB, in almost every situation, the education they received is related to what they are teaching.

A lot of teachers pay for their pension out of deferred wages. It depends on the state. But Wisconsin, for example, has an extremely stable pension system, and the pension money came directly out of teacher wages.

Yeah? No. Tenure in the public school field means due process. Not only are teachers fired before they get due process if necessary, but it is fairly easy to fire a teacher if they actually do something wrong. Additionally, there is no profession more altruistic than education. A teacher, with their level of education, could get a higher job in a lot of private sector fields, but they choose to teach kids.

I’ve observed that characteristic of the baggers and wingers myself. Is it cause-and-effect or effect-and-cause?

I am a teacher and the first time I saw the bumper sticker that said, n “Those who can do, and those who can’t teach” nI thought, n “You only do, because you were TAUGHT!

e-6? No college? To be a teacher, you have to be a college grad…so that would be OFFICER retirement. Officers certainly make more than 19k/yr in their pension.

I am an award winning Canadian Physics teacher (from my University…. U of Waterloo Canada’s MIT) and in Ontario Canada teachers are paid approximately $95000 per year so guess what there is huge competition from the brightest for those jobs, at least in the board I retired from after 30 years, and while it is not perfect we have a public education system that puts most American ones to shame. I sent hundreds and hundreds of students to Universities like Waterloo, Toronto, Western, UBC, and yes MIT, Duke Harvard, Cornell, Yale and they thrived. nnWe don’t have to cut cut cut because we did not have an elite class of bankers gamble the money needed for good education away. Our banks were government regulated and NOT ONE CAME CLOSE TO FAILING because of that. (note Australia also, UK unfortunately had a Maggie Thatcher and Tony Blair who bought into (too much government)nnWhat you have is too little government too afraid or bought off by those bankers etc who nearly brought down the world financial system. nnYour greed class gambled away your kids birthright and now you take it out on those you give absolutely shitty wages to. Right wing deregulation is the cause of the decline of the US Imperium. nnOh and you spend far too much money trying to run the world and that is also bankrupting you. nnAt the beginning of the Iraq war our dollar was about 70 cents it has recently been as high as 1.03 USnnOne last thing if there is nobody above you in wages you have no argument for better pay and you end up fighting for the scraps. nnnnnn

I agree. I am new to disqus and am unpleasantly shocked by many of the comments here. nMany commenters do not seem to understand that this type of narrow, conservative thinking is ignorant, uninformed, and mean spirited.

I have yet to see a sacrifice by all of government. No governor, congressman,or senator has had their pay reduced. They are not paying for their health care , we the tax payers are. In addition they can’t even give the American people an honest week’s work.They can’t work more than 3 weeks at a time. So when you talk about nooks and crannies are you referring to them? And let’s talk about their pensions, what are they contributing? But they want the middle class and the poor to pay , sacrifice and suck it up. That’s not whining you hear , it’s the beginning of a roar . You may want to get some ear plugs , the working class has had enough and we are not going to keep taking it.

I have yet to see a sacrifice by all of government. No governor, congressman,or senator has had their pay reduced. They are not paying for their health care , we the tax payers are. In addition they can’t even give the American people an honest week’s work.They can’t work more than 3 weeks at a time. So when you talk about nooks and crannies are you referring to them? And let’s talk about their pensions, what are they contributing? But they want the middle class and the poor to pay , sacrifice and suck it up. That’s not whining you hear , it’s the beginning of a roar . You may want to get some ear plugs , the working class has had enough and we are not going to keep taking it.

teachers, as most of us, plan their future by tomorrow’s pay. Goal setting is based on future potential. If my soldier daughter and son-in-law signed up with an agreement to receive a certain amount of money at the age of 65, under what circumstances may the government break that contract? Soldier’s futures are planned around future income. From what I’ve seen, teachers are a lot like soldiers nowadays. They are troupers and sometimes suck it up.

I hope you’re half as good a teacher as you think you are. Schools need teachers. Teachers can pass on valuable lessons in mathematics, economics, philosophy, and civics. If this is done, children will know why public sector unions are an abomination against freedom, why they were rejected by even FDR, why JFK cemented the relationship between democrats and educators, and why MY TAX DOLLARS go to support communist agitators like the fool on this stage.

“their” life, not “there” life. Maybe if you’d listened to teachers instead of criticizing them, you’d be able to write functionally in English. I think you also need a comma after “back to”.nnBy the way, do you get Saturday and Sunday off? Overtime when you have to work over 40 hours? Is your 12 year old in school instead of working in a factory? Does your workplace have fire exits? You can thank the UNION members who marched and fought and, yes, DIED, who were shot and beaten and attacked by dogs, to win us these rights.

Misinformed and incorrect. They are not trying to “pin it” on teachers. They ARE trying to end the Unions that simply take from teachers and use their money to fund the campaigns of politicians and the coffers of the Union elite!

You have found the one thing that FDR said that you could agree with. Well if FDR is an authority for you, I suggest you read up on what else he said. Oh, and up yours.

Every one of the bad teachers I had was a conservative.

u201cWhere free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost.u201dnnIf you want to quote FDR, I’ll quote Reagan right back at you. Oh, and he was talking about public sector unions, there were no private trade unions in Poland.

I’ve been reading your statements and replies, and clearly you are little more than just another Ditto-Head (and probably proud of it).nnI hardly know where to begin with you, but I’ll go ahead and start with this:n Yes, public education teachers are public employees, just like firemen, police, public health workers, postal clerks, transportation workers, garbage collectors, and other civil servants, and as such they are paid by the taxpaying bodyu2014you, me, Aunt Betty and Uncle Earl, the woman down the street, the pizza guy…you get it, right?n But did you know that these public employees also pay taxes? That their paycheck withholdings are as high as yours or mine? That they are, in effect, paying themselves?n Somehow this lean little fact gets forgotten in any discussion about the unfairness of taxpayer supported wages!nnAs for unions:n Like laws governing public safety, civil rights, and environmental protection, unions would not be necessary if humans weren’t greedy and unjust. If we, the workers, could trust our employers to treat us fairly and pay us a living wage, we would not require the protection and advocacy provided by unions. In the same vein, if we could trust ourselves not to rob liquor stores, discriminate against someone because of their color, or poison water supplies by dumping waste chemicals, we wouldn’t need laws forbidding such behavior.nnPublic schools are necessary and the best invention of the civilized world. Without them, and the dedicated teachers who work hard at their jobs despite the meager pay, long hours and constant stress, most of our population would be absolutely illiterate (i.e., can’t read at all), ignorant of all but their tiny slice of existence, and destined by birthright to a life of grinding poverty, endless labor, and intellectual darkness. This used to be the life of the vast majority of the West’s population when education was a rich man’s privilege, rather than an ordinary man’s right. Look in those places in the world today where there are no public schools, and even where a system exists, there are insufficient resources and teachers to make the system function. Would you want to live that life?nnTell me, where would you be without the teachers in your life?

The grammar police are wonderful on here, but the replies never answer to the lazy Union teachers. If you had Johnny or Suzie, in school and he/she made an F…your telling me the teacher is not PART of the problem?? I find that amazing….

It is true that in all too many districts private schools are not required by law to hire someone with the education and teacher training that public systems demand.

Excellent!!

I find it so interesting that anytime someone utters a statement in support of unions or universal public programs or anything that benefits the true majority, some righty-tighty out there uses the C word. I’m a liberal, but that doesn’t mean I sleep with a Marx, Lenin, and Mao under my pillow!

Mr. Langley, your points are well taken for what happened with “Garment District” fires in the early 1900′s in NYC. The purpose then of forming a UNION was for the WORKER, and your telling me that now the UNIONS still think, or feel that way now?? We both know what makes up the higher UNION leadership..individuals that make a huge wage on the backs of those UNION members for “protecting” or “keeping” an ineffective teacher…which is usually moved around. Or a “teacher” that can’t teacher so we will make him or her a Leader in the UNION office!! (Sounds like the Catholic Church to some degree)nnThe costs of these UNIONS are passed on to you and myself. Higher property or sales tax and for what. So the “fat cat” UNION leaders can live that life of luxury that most enjoy that the “teachers” will never see. So comparing the “sweat shops” which had no fire exits…is a big insult to those people who died, or experienced those events. Do you really think those UNION members of the early 1900′s would think of what is going on now is what their friends died for??nnLook at the “Teacher UNION” leadership look at the limos, very expensive suits, their lifestyles….I mean there the leaders….so yes, it has an effect on how the UNION is lead. An of course your an Attorney…so where is your UNION…oh, right you just have a License to steal…from people in need. Where is the “due process”.

Amazing “teachers” are not “sacred cows”…It is wonderful that there to teach, because there good. But the lazy ineffective UNION teacher has found a place to “hide” and just show up….in a UNION shop…so they have no worries..just show up for a “check”.nnGo to the private sector and work at a real job…most would not last. A real job without the UNION shop rules. Yes, you have to work and deal with problems, and yes, you will be fired without “due process”……that is called the “real world”.

Twenty-two years of teaching and I feel rich! I never think about how much I make, as long as I have enough money to fill the Jolly Rancher Jar.

Okay, Guys, this is just dumb. It’s a poetry slam performance, so his behavior on stage is not necessarily true to everyday life. Do you guys actually think that this is how he behaves in a classroom? Have you never grossly exaggerated a statement in order to make a point?nBelieve me, union or no, if this guy acted like a screaming tyrannical bully in his classroom, he would have been fired.

Vince, UNIONS have killed the American spirit…by the UNION shops where people do not have to work…just show up and get a check. Just like with “scared cow” teachers…the bad and ineffective ones are collecting a check…nnMr, Beltrami, your well aware that the UNIONS are nothing like what they started out to be to help the UNION member!! Now, it is set up to help the “fat cat” UNION leaders to have a wonderful life on the rank and files back!!

Mr. Beltrami, your one of the UNION “fat cats” for the IBEW…wow, your living on the backs of your “rank and file” there in Alaska. Nice…over paid UNION members for pulling wire..run the costs up on building and pass the cost on to the consumer. Wonderful Get a real job in a non-UNION shoo, or away from the “fat cat” brotherhood!

Really? So it’s okay with you that CORPORATIONS fund politicians? Do you know that of the 7 largest political funders only 3 are unions and the lowest at that? So what if our unions form pacs? That is their right. And for your information, out DUES aren’t used for politicians. we are asked to donate to a pac IF WE CHOOSE TO DO SO. Since the supreme court has decided that corporations are people they can donate millions and millions to their pet politicians. So YOU are misinformed, Fox (so called) News lover.

Do you not realize that it isn’t unions protecting teachers? There is a process to eliminate bad teachers through evaluations, write ups, documentation and due process. The problem is: principals do not have TIME to do all the “dirty work” because they are overworked with everything else. Unions only protect teachers, if there is NO documentation, then districts have no legs to stand on w/o documentation of following what teachers are doing. This is what is misconstrued in society, we gotta have someone to blame; Unions. They cannot protect with a trail of paper, if the teacher has means for dismissal and documentation, then unions cannot do anything about it. Ask your parents, they would agree that a paper trail is what gets a teacher out, but districts do not do this! Go to a school and learn facts before you judge.

You clearly have an issue with paying for benefits for public employees. How about for military employees? My sister is retired Army and she receives a pension and other veteran’s benefits. Should she be cut off because she was a public employee?nnAnd what makes you think that public employees don’t pay into their own benefits? My mother and her husband both worked for for our local school system, and they had to pay into their retirement plans.nnIs there, in fact, anyplace in the nation in which public employees, union or not, don’t pay for part of their own benefits like everyone else?

I wouldnt say “TOO MANY”…have you been in schools? I’ll trade you for a day and you would change your mind. Go into the schools….there are SOME that don’t care, I agree, but MOST do….we are glorified babysitters….I love my job and proud to do what I love. My building is about 80% caring, so go see/visit before you judge.

Pinned on all of government, huh? Has your governor reduced his pay and benefits? Has your governor refused or decided to pay for his or her government funded health care? MY governor hasn’t and he also refuses to tax out of state gas drilling companies so they are free to rape our state of it’s natural resources and pollute our waters for free! So we are losing millions in funds and yet he is cutting education, the arts, social programs that benefit the common man all with the excuse that “everyone has to share in the burden”. It’s a culture war and the republican establishment is coordinating the effort nation wide to dumb us down so we don’t have the brains to see what is happening all around us.

Educational research shows time and time again that the most accurate way to predict school success or failure is the income level of the parents. Period. nnI’m not referring to individual success–rich kids can fail and poor kids can excel–but to school districts. Yet comments like yours show no understanding of this. If a teacher has 28 children of Spanish-speaking migrant farmworker families, and the children don’t pass the state assessment, is the teacher lazy? Or is he struggling against impossible odds? Teachers have students who live in homes with no electricity, living out of their cars, or trying to do their homework in a freezing trailer crowded with people. If the kids don’t make acceptable yearly progress, how is this the teacher’s fault?

Property taxesu2014Hey! Teachers and policemen pay property taxes, too, don’t they? Whatu2014are you claiming that these lazy people who just collect a paycheck without earning it don’t pay property taxes either? Wow! What great work! I want to be a unionized public employee so that I can earn the big bucks and fat benefits and never have to pay my property taxes, or SS, or workman’s comp, or state and fed income taxes, and get it all while not doing one damn stitch of real work! Sign me up!

Right, unions are destroying America. How about greedy CEOs that are paid huge bonuses even when they run their companies into the ground? How about the US banking system that conspired to allow millions of bad mortgages to make a buck then cried that needed a tax payer bail out then KEPT all that money, and used it to pay bonuses? Where’s your outrage about that? How about corporations earning higher profits in 2010 than EVER BEFORE yet not hiring because they’re “afraid” of the economy? But no, save your anger for unions and teachers, putz.

You sound like such an angry person who doesn’t have much to do except post your tirades anonymously. nI’ve been reading your slams on unions and your blanket statements about how destructive they are. Where do you get your information from? Where is your anger coming from? What direct experience do you have regarding unions across all walks of life? What makes you the expert? I’m in a union and glad of it. We are far from lazy and just “show up to get a paycheck”. I’m in an industry that relies on a good worker and if you aren’t, you are gone. We work an average of 12-14 hours a day. You don’t want to do that? Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. You are late? Buh bye. nSave your anger, troll……you might have a heart attack and then that union nurse might not be there to take care of you because they have been let go due to “cost cutting”. Maybe the janitor can help you.

Using the Charlie Sheen method, are you? duh. really. nYou are such an angry, nasty person, I can just imagine how you treat your workers.

You do realize that taxpayers pay ALL of teacher’s wages, right?

Wow, and your a UNION nurse…sounds like your really happy with your working conditions….I am sure the UNION worked for those 12 to 14 hr days…I believe then you have 4 days off most likely…Work 36 and get paid for 40…nice UNION benefits. The rest of us have to work 40 to get paid for that….nnPush the ‘call button” and begin the WAIT for the very “happy” nurse…who is mad at the world because of the 12 hr shift they begged for, and mad at the DR.who has written orders so she or he has to carry out…and those damn “call lights”, what do they think I care…I am a UNION NURSE!!

When I became a teacher 10 years ago, I went to an orientation- one comment at that orientation has always stuck with me- ” Every profession begins with teachers, everyone owes their accomplishments to at least one teacher”. The teacher bashing in this country has got to stop. For education to be successful it need s to be a community effort including teachers, administrations, parents and the students. It is not a one way street. if any of you would like to come hang out in my inner city high school classroom and save the world please do so!!

Checking on the days that cars are built and we should not buy them because of these particular days…..lets see..It is a Monday or a Friday, because the UNION workers..are hung over on Monday, and Friday it is the weekend…the wonderful UNIONS…how many Autoworkers were receiving a paycheck, and not even having to work, or show up?? The UNION protected them…we paid for it in the car price….

So passing the buck..it is the Principles fault now…WOW…Please it is the UNION that protects them…

Dear Sharon, You have been listening to NPR…See your part of the liberal media….please slow down on the Vodka and LEMONS…..the lazy ineffective teachers..keep their jobs as you probably do with your UNION.nnI am sure your aware that the UNIONS have destroyed most if not all “Steel” jobs there in PA?? The UNIONS demanded to much money for the lazy steelworker…so yes, the businessmen and businesswomen moved it overseas…it is called making a “profit”. Please listen to another channel besides NPR…to bad the funding can not be pulled!!

Please just remember that a good deal of what goes into the pensions is actually coming from the teacher’s own salary. It’s not like all the money is somehow coming just from you. In Illinois, contrary to popular belief, teachers pay 75% of their pensions in the end–25% comes from taxpayers. And don’t forget that they get no Social Security–they don’t pay into that system. From Illinois Retirement Security Initiative: “Out of 87,000 retired teachers in Illinois, 17,269 receive a pension that’s less than $20,000. A few administrators (only 2 percent of retirees) receive large pensions of more than $100,000.”nI mostly see people out here oversimplify arguments, use logical fallacies, and the like, just to make their points. All that will matter in the end, is not the caliber, sincerity, or depth of discussion–but just who has the most power to steamroll their agenda through. That, at least, seems to be Republican’s strategy at this point. Not that Dem’s are necessarily better. But doesn’t it bother anyone that no one–even many posting here–just won’t listen to each other, or even try?

We also pay for nurses at public hospitals, firefighters, postal workers, parks departments. We pay the salaries of senators and governors and presidents, too. (I’m so sorry for the teachers in Wisconsin when I think that some of their tax dollars pay for Gov. Walker.)

You have taken UNION out of US Constitution…WOW now that is the LIBERAL LEAP!!! not referring to the “fat cat UNIONS” of today…wow, that liberal education is really paying off!!

Agree,,,,the e.g below that 80% are good and 20% bad…wow that is something to be so proud of…..

These are great posts! I’ll take them to my students. They can practice using correct grammar, punctuation and spelling by editing them. Your post should, of course, read: nn”Were you union? The taxpayer paid the largest portion of the benefits you’re still enjoying, correct?” nnI really enjoy the all-capital-letters you use for UNION. Shows how important unions are!

I’ve spent my entire career in the private sector. I’ve seen a number of coworkers who seemed (to me) as if they were getting paid just for showing up. Maybe they were, maybe they weren’t: the fact is that in almost any work environment, union or non-union, it’s hard to make good judgments about performance, and it’s hard to weed out the bad apples without losing a lot of good ones too.nnIf you’re a sports fan, you’ve probably argued about whether so-and-so is a bum or a great player. That’s in a job where the worker’s performance is completely in the public view, and measured by any number of statistical categories. And yet, fans *still* can’t agree on who’s good and who isn’t.nnHow do you *measure* the performance of a teacher? It’s the ultimate in intellectual laziness to grade teachers on their students’ test results without considering where those students came from. Nor does it seem wise to assume that every valuable quality in a teacher, and every aspect of education, can be objectively measured through testing. Even athletes have their so-called “intangibles”.nnMy kids have now spent 20 years in our town’s public school system. I’ve met some great teachers, a couple mediocre ones, and maybe one bad one. But not one — *not one* — has treated the job as a sinecure. Every one of them has been available to meet with their students or parents before or after school, or during their lunch hours. Every one of them has put time into preparing for classes and grading homework after their “work hours” are done.nnI challenge you to identify *one* teacher in your town’s school system who is not worth their pay, and to make a good case for why that teacher should be fired.

Very aware, and such a waste of my property taxes and sales tax money. My children are in Private Schools…because of the lazy UNION teachers that are through out the public school systems…that do nothing…so I am paying twice…to educate my children…

It is called WORK,,,that is what a JOB is…but the UNIONS, want to make it easy on the members…not workers..as your well aware of with the ones “didn’t want to work”.

Crissa ..please open your eyes to the real world..not what your UNION leaders are telling you to look at….

Mandeville….SUP? I work about 60 to 70 hrs a week…an I am a Democrat, and have been all my life, but I am over it…the lack of work coming from the President should be enough to show you how ineffective “lazy people are”. And that were i worst shape than when W was in power…that the UNIONS keep sucking what life there is out of business…

No. I worked in Texas, just about last in benefits, pay, and working conditions. And results. The job was hard. After 30 years I could no longer continue physically. I have now spent 10 years as a technical writer with two weeks of vacation, and I have the time and energy to volunteer for several non-profit organizations. I’m also earning more. Teaching is a brutal job. nYou know the REAL reason why teachers aren’t as good any more? It’s because of affirmative action. Women no longer have to be teachers. And they aren’t. So you’re left with a substandard labor pool. Who would want to work with undisciplined kids, endure adult abuse, and not get paid? Only those who couldn’t get any other job. I couldn’t be hired as an engineer when I graduated from college. My daughter is an electrical engineer. The difference? Affirmative action. nNotice, please, that I am still very much in the work force after 40 years, with a 40-week and a 2 1/2 hour commute every day. And I’m not alone. Teacher retirement in Texas wouldn’t be enough to live on. And we’re forbidden to use Social Security. I’ll be working until I die.

So you were at this event??/

So, another lazy teacher…looking for work to fill time…wonderful. I am sure your school is so proud of you!! No, UNIONS are not that important as your well aware there almost gone….So Coffee Party, your a UNION member…and we know that does not equal worker…a UNION member….a way to get out of work!!

Funny thing is, unions were built on passion, strength, and justice too. They certainly didn’t form out of servile surrender.nnAnd you have heard, haven’t you, of the rights to free speech and to peaceably assemble? If workers wish to form a union, how do you stop them without violating one or both of those rights?

Dr. Keller, is part of the ELITE liberal education league…has never worked in the real world. Hidden in the field of Education…wow….it is amazing the Ph.D.’s, can preacher etc…but work…LOL..”The Ones that can’t work teach”. Even at the University of Kentucky!!

Regardless of all the political postings here, I must say that I’m married to a teacher and she takes her job just as seriously as the guy in the video does. She makes a difference every day she shows up at that school. I couldn’t be any more proud of her, and what she does.

It’s Chris Harris who is misinformed and incorrect! What is the MOST SIGNIFICANT difference between a 3rd world country like Angola & the U.S.? Education. We have a highly educated population. Attacking teachers’ unions is attacking the only institution that allows teachers to make a living wage. Virtually the only institution that stands up for school funding, for improving our education. nnAnd without an IMPROVING educational system we are eating the seed corn of future economic growth and falling further and further behind the rest of the world. nnWithout a living wage the best and brightest people will not become teachers. Without that our education system falls apart and we become a third world country like Haiti! nnWe are already cutting back more and more because we “can’t afford” to educate our children? Why not? Because we cut taxes on the top 1% and wasted Trillions on foreign wars. nnThe attack on teachers and teachers’ unions is utter folly.

You had made then at the very end lost me. Instead of Blessing God for Making that difference you cursed God. I make a difference from following my heart first which led me to more knowledge. God Bless.

enjoyed the lesson learned; hated that he had to use God’s name in vain to support his opinions!

And how many of the bad apples are politicians right now? Just a thought.

why can’t people understand that private donations are just that! Private and personal! Public Unions use others money (MY TAX $) to do so…. BIG DIFF!

The time has come for change in America regarding unions, especially PUBLIC. We all love teachers and using them and the children aas pawns is a crime as well. Unions have destroyed our biggest business’s such as the auto and airline industry. They render us non competitive and this is now a GLOBAL world market. Public Unions are even more destructive as they do not improve education at all. It’s just a big mafia of misuse… America needs to move towards a performance based society for us ALL to prosper… especially the CHILDREN!

Partially valid point, but does not apply here. The IEP team as a whole is good and fully staffed, this teacher just had a bad attitude and quit at the end of the year. And wrongful termination laws protect whistleblowers.But the union tries to convice that they are needed for this. Public sector unions are just wrong, and theier buying of politicians who negotiate the contracts should be criminal.

SDTrader,nnYou are no more a business owner of 25 years than a Republicon is a good money manager. But I will play along for now. nnYou hurl juvenile insults and you avoid answering questions. So I have a few for you.nn1) How much should a good high school math teacher of 5 years and in good standing make annually? nn2) Should every American have guaranteed health care for life? nn3) Should Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker give up his lifetime government pension? nn4) Should Scott Walker pay more for his government health care? nn5) Should Scott Walker reduce his annual salary by 20%? More?nn6) Do you believe Bank of America should have been bailed out by taxpayer money, or should BOA been allowed to go out of business?nn7) General Motors posted a profit this year and are giving bonuses. Why? nnn

Read this four times and cannot make sense of most of it! What is truly an infringement? You appear to mention Chavez favorably and claim the victim status of the working man. You have been well indoctrinated.

Catch up here…unions had their day, they are generally no longer needed and we could never return to that time.. And the difference is between public and private sector unions. Public unions use their power to by the politicianns that negotiate the contracts that spend the money of people who have now say in the contracts. And public workers generally already have a monopoly. Even Roosevelt and Meany knew public sector unions were wrong. And nothing wrong with getting a fair competitive wage. But most public sector employees make far better than private sector already.n

I think it’s a good defense of good teachers. The idea that we have to categorically appreciate the work of anyone who is a teacher, regardless of how they do their job is absolutely ridiculous, and that is why it is not getting any traction from Democrats or Republicans who are in power and make policy.

In my dealing with a couple of principles I think there is a lot of truth to what you say!

Good, valid points here. We should eliminate the NEA while we are trying to balance a budget with over a trillion dollars in red ink. The decline started when the NEA was started! And the moral decline and loss of families and family values is certainly a factor. Perhaps if the money wasn’t going to large pensions there would be money for supplies.n

It’s just teachers and their unions whining because children don’t understand what’s going on and can’t advocate for themselves. THAT’S why the teachers are standing up and making noise.

Why can’t you people (Fox News syncophants) spell correctly or compose and punctuate a grammatically correct sentence!!?? nAt least your ignorant comments wouldn’t be ignorantly presented as well…nAs it is, you are complete as a moron.

Again if so much money wasn’t going to pay, benefits and pensions there could be more textbooks. Contrary to your opinion teacher compensation is not low compared to the average income. So teaching only a disproven theory of evolution as if it were fact is acceptable? Perhaps the schools shouldn’t teach on how we got here at all. And again unions provide no protection that is not already in the law. Unions are a campaign and fund raising tool for politicians who only seek power, with little desire to what is good for all.n

The covering of the creation theory is not teaching religion. Presenting the theory of evolution, which is disproven by Darwins own argument, as fact is indoctrination. Teaching of creation as a theory does not touch on Christ or Mohammed or involve any “religon”. After that you get into the question of why we are here and that is not for the schools to answer. That should be discussed at home.

Agreed, we need stronger families and values and administrators and others who will point that out and stand for it.

Really? If those teachers are so underpaid let them find better pay else where. Oh, but they can’t as they already make almost half again as much as private sector workers. Right now there are hundreds of teachers across America who are unemployed who would be happy to get those ‘low’ paying jobs. I see a lot of greedy teachers putting their own needs in front of the needs of society.

After reading the comments here I’m just glad that the conservatives have finally realized it does take a village to raise a child. Otherwise why are they blaming the teacher for their kids failing, instead of the 1 mom and 1 dad they used to claim is all a child takes to raise a child.

TERRIFIC! Teachers are just not appreciated enough and definitely not paid enough to put up with the students and the parents and the system and the politics that they do . Mom of a teacher

Teacher unions do not keep bad teachers from getting fired. They simply force administrators to provide due process for all employees. They have to provide physical evidence (over time) that a teacher is incompetant before they can be fired. This prevents a public educator–(who is afterall) licensed by the state department–from being fired by an individual based on personal bias. In my district all employees go through a three-year probationary period where their contract can be terminated at any moment. They are then placed on a five-year cycle of formal evaluations to help monitor their progress as an effective employee. With all of the diversities a teacher has to be prepared for in classrooms that have constantly-changing populations (ie: ESL, RTi, high-transient, high-poverty)–it is refreshing to know that a union will at least hold employers accountable for their hiring decisions.nn

If my spelling sucks it’s because I didn’t listen to my teacher in class or she just wasn’t good enough. We all learn a different way. I am in support of my new governor Scott Walker because we needed to change our system and he is doing what he promised. My wife is a teacher and I am an independent contractor. My wifeu2019s benefits are good but not great. But as for her healthcare, some people might say she has it good. We do….. But a true fact is that out of her pay she contributes $300.00 Bi-weekly to her healthcare. That is six hundred dollars a month. The average worker contributes $500.00 per month. They are not to far off from each other. My wife makes $34,000 a year before her contribution. The average Wisconsin worker makes $36,000 a year. Once again they are about the same. Scott Walker is not trying to attack teachers but is trying to get our budget down and if you really read his plan and not take judgment till you are done you will see that it could make a difference and the school systems can prosper from this by being able to now negotiate with Union workers and private workers to get the best results for our children. Scott Walker is doing what he said he was going to do….Balance Our Budget….. Some things I don’t agree on with his plan and some I do. Give the man credit for having the Ba–s to go after anyone to get this job done. The whole system at the state and federal level needs to be re-structured. For example- I was in the US Army and under the insurance program I paid $250.00 a month family plan. Great coverage (The Best). There are hundreds of thousands of people under this plan but it is only offered to government employed people. Why the hell can’t this be out there for everyone? $250.00 compared to my wifeu2019s $600.00 a month is quite the jump. This is an example of one thing that could help. There are many more as we all know it. Scott Walker is taking on these issues an I give him thumbs up. He still has a huge amount of work ahead to balance this budget too so look forward to him doing cuts in other areas too. It all has to start somewhere and we all have to do our part. I hope everyone would just pitch in and maybe we all could start with Wisconsin and lead by example and maybe someday will have a president who will dare to take on these challenges at the federal level. My wife is busy grading papers on a Saturday so she doesn’t have time to correct my grammer…lol

I am utterly amazed to see that rich and mostly useless fat cats like the Koch brothers are actually succeeding in getting workers to turn on each other. We will never solve the problem of the declining middle class by taking chunks out of teachers, police officers, public sector employees or any other class of workers who live on wages and do not have the advantages of ever-growing wealth merely for owning things. Teachers have an impossible job, and we just seem determined to make it harder and harder, in some misguided notion that taxpayers will be able to pocket a couple of extra dollars and all else will remain unchanged. Wake up people! We are just playing Russian roulette, but let us note who put the bullet in the gun and is too smart to be standing in the circle with us as it gets handed around.

“it’s services” seestraight? –correction: its services.nYou’re welcome from an english teacher

you mean woe is me.. looks like you could use some education yourself

Are you serious? What part of the private sector are you referring to? McDonald’s employees, maybe. Compare the salary of a teacher to any other profession that requires the same amount of education that teaching requires, and you will see that teaching certainly does not come out on top. In fact, it is probably the lowest, except for perhaps social workers.

If the majority of teachers were fired based on job performance who would they get to replace them? That’s a lot of staffing!

You can’t just look at the “average” income and compare a teacher’s income to that. You have to look at the “average” income of another person with a 4-year degree plus a certification program, or, more likely, the “average” income of someone with a Master’s degree. Teaching does NOT to well when held up to these standards, which are the proper standards to use when comparing teaching to other professions. You don’t need a Master’s degree to work at the Gap, so a Gap employee’s salary cannot be compared with a teacher’s salary.

Do you think you will ever need a police officer, a firefighter, or a nurse in an emergency room? Is mail delivered to your house by a postal worker? All those folks are union.nnI’m wondering if you share the opinion of some people that we should have private companies, instead of public workers, performing all those tasks? Or should those jobs not be filled at all, and each person takes care of his or her own medical needs, road repair, protection from crime, and educating their children?nnYou mention that you send your own children to private school. What about the children of the poor, who have no money for private education? Do you support vouchers, then?nn

If only it were folly. Based on your opening paragraph, I see that one way to really destroy the middle class is to destroy the education that creates it. Then you have a genuine proletariat, comprised of drones and also-rans. Oh wait, they call them Ditto-Heads

You rule, Crissa! Heylookingfor and SDTrader, when they aren’t working 60-70 hours a week, enjoy trying to provoke people anonymously online. They enjoy seeing others as angry and bitter as they are.

Oh WOW. You GO, dude. Rant ON.

Jeanne-dArc as we can tell your no Joan of Arc at all…I am a life time Democrat and so over President Obama with his “do nothing’ attitude. His handlers believe if he makes a speech, shows up that solves the problem. He just does not care at all he realizes now he has to have money to run again so he might do something in the near future. As we also see in these UNION teachers there crying because some of there benefits “might” be cut. Half the USA would love to have benefits of some type!!! The same as with the worthless President. Two and half years…an OUR world is really no better it is really a lot worst….and you know that Ms. Jeanne, but you can not admit it. The liberal media states the unemployment roles are falling…sure people are falling off the roles of being able to collect benefits….they have just disappeared….Does your wonderful liberal mind realize that?? Volunteer at one of the soup kitchens as I do every Tuesday and Friday and learn what is going on in your world..leave the “IVORY TOWER” for a couple hours…reach outside of yourself…be a little like Joan of Arc…nn The Democrats might have a chance if Hillary would run….the general working and non-working public is so over the “do nothing Obama”. We might have a chance to save our world. If she does not run the Democrats will not have the White House for over 8 years…nnWrap your grammar mind around that aspect..of the Republicans being in power for another 8 or more year!!! Look at the real problem….not the grammar. An also admit that UNION workers are lazy…using the UNION as there cover to not work…Good luck….Please come down from the Tower!!…

9mos? huh!!?? My wife teaches and it is a 60hr a week job for her and that means she works for 20 hours extra as a no overtime pay. She works on weekends and thorughout the Summer coming up with countless ideas to bring to her classroom. She spends about $1000 a school year out of her pocket (never reimbursed) to supply her classroom with countless items that aren’t part of the everyday curriculum. Our state does not have unions so she doesn’t have that to fall back on. Also, she pays about 6 to 7 times more for her health care than the unionized Wisconsin teachers. She has earned two Masters degrees and has 30+ extra hours of continuing education. She is well more qualified than most public sector employees and gets paid way less than her equals. She actually was studying Law and then one day realized that her calling would be better spent teaching than in Law. She started in special ed and is now a 3rd grade teacher. Do you think she knows how much money she gave up for her change in career path? She is a Teacher of the Year and is on numerous district committees. There isn’t a day that goes by that she doesn’t get a coompliment from a current or past parent or student telling her what a huge difference she has made in the classroom. I guess if you want to measure that in worth, she is a billionaire!!!!!!

Mandeville, Heylookingfor can claim to work 60-70 hours a week whether it’s true or not, then turn around to call others lazy UNION teachers, because he never will have to look these people in the eye and see the truth.

Coffee Party, Please go to your local Post Office….and tell me you think those people work.. the lobby has 20 people in line with money in hand, and they close down from two clerks to one, because “it is my break”, they get a 10 min break every hour on the hour..UNION at its finest…i guess that is why the Post office MAKES MONEY.nnNurses, firefighters, and police…why do they need a UNION to protect them from what?? Answer that…nnI am a Democrat an I support the vouchers, and also pay for two other children from the inner city to go to a good school So, they might have a chance away from the lazy UNION teachers of our city…the ineffective, lazy ones, collecting a check…and no way to remove…and the taxpayer is stuck without any recourse….just pay and pay….

Well, we have to admit that Gov. Cuomo of NY gave back part of his pay…though let’s keep firmly in mind that he is a fairly wealthy man–his income in 2004 was over a million. If I had that much money in the bank, I’d take a pay cut, too.

Why is OK for corporations to pour billions on to political campaigns for things abolishing the minimum wage and relaxing child labor laws but when unions through in a little money to appose these things its a bad thing.

Yes. Please re-hinge me.

Coffee party…are you far to the left…you really believe that Postal Workers really work…go to the lobby of your Post Office on Monday mid-morning and see how many windows are open with the lobby full of customers!!! So is that a way to run a business….and your telling those UNION Postal Workers..care if your standing there…when the LAST time the Post office showed a profit, or even broke even??????nnThank goodness we do not have Public hospitals to deal with a nurses UNION….Coffee Party…you really believe UNIONS are good???

Do you?n

@ J Ti is not YOUR TAX MONEY when wages are payed to teachers or any other public employee it is no longer tax money it is personal income and there free to spent it on what ever they like not a Penney of tax money gos into public union….. Please educate your self

Sounds like she does not, but you do for sure. Tell her to go to the Private Sector to find a job…oh, that is right there are no jobs i the US now..No one tells her to spend money out of her own pocket…do without if required, have the parents pay for it etc…There is always an answer for the problem….We all pay 6 to 7 times for out health care Mr. Wayne….nnif she or you are unhappy with what she is being paid…leave the school system this is America she can take her two masters’ and move on….a master’s does not mean 100K year job…

This is an interesting video. I am a relatively new teacher (2 years) who came to this profession after a career in the military. I must say that before I taught in the public schools, my views mirrored those of many conservatives. However, actually spending time in the classroom in a public school in a large city has caused me to reexamine some of my views regarding the teaching profession. I have come to have tremendous respect for the teachers in my school. I do not know one teacher who is milking the system or hiding behind the union while they draw a paycheck. I do know some very gifted teachers who are changing lives in a challenging environment in a building that is nearly a century old. In my school I see teachers who are held accountable and bear a great burden not just to deliver instruction, but to provide data, modify their instruction so that what they do produces measurable outcomes, and deal with the whole host of problems that young people bring to school in an urban environment in this day and age. Should teachers have advocacy to protect them against arbitrary actions and to provide due process? Definitely. However, power on either side should not be unbounded. Unions and administration should work together in a cooperative fashion to make the most out of what limited funds are available with the primary goal being education of young people. The old adversarial paradigm where the administration wants unlimited control and unions want ever-increasing pay and benefits regardless of cost to the taxpayer must cease. There has to be responsibility and restraint on both sides, or the problems that plague our schools will never cease, and the young people we are paid to educate will continue to fall behind. I realize, however, that it’s easy to say all this and much tougher to make it happen in the real world. It seems obvious to me, however, that sitting in our respective ivory towers and shouting at each other is not working.

If it were only true……… we’d be as great as Teachers say we are…. the competitive data says otherwise……. They need to accept criticism and feedback to grow and learn just as you and I do…. They ‘collectively’ dismiss this process……. If it were only true……..

Thank you. Someone who realizes that teacher pay needs to be compared to other professions with the same amount of required education. People who think teacher salaries compare favorably to any other profession with similar education requirements are just kidding themselves.

other professions arent defined by ‘the few that are bad’ because they can manage ‘the few that are bad’.. . The few become many over time in a system that protects them….. Dont want to be judged by them? Then dont create a system that protects and rewards them. Allow the Great Ones to flourish and produce the product that they can be proud …. Get out of the way……….

Gees MrMustard1 I didn’t know you knew what I did for a living. Sorry you don’t own your own business and that you have to work for the “man”. I’ll answer your questions below but I can tell you are just a black and white thinker by the questions you asked which explains why you still work for the “man”.nn1) How much should a good high school math teacher of 5 years and in good standing make annually?nnIf you live in WI, which I am assuming you do based off all of your Scott Walker questions, $30k-$40k would be very adequate after only 5 years as a teacher. Didn’t you CHOOSE to teach or were you forced to care about educating kids?nn2) Should every American have guaranteed health care for life?nnAbsolutely not. We live in a country of opportunities not a nanny state. As an entrepreneur times like everyone else can be lean, so at times I could not afford health insurance for my family. But it did make us more health conscious and we rarely ever got sick. But one thing I did not do was whine to the government that they owed me healthcare. I want the government to stay out of my way so I can make more money to be self sufficient enough myself to pay for it on MY OWN!nn3) Should Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker give up his lifetime government pension?nnWhy should ANY politician receive lifetime pensions? Any pension received should be based off the time in office. And I believe in term limits so no pension should last very long. Just as an example if one held office for 4 years give him/her a 4 year pension.nn4) Should Scott Walker pay more for his government health care?nnHow do I know. What does he pay now?nn5) Should Scott Walker reduce his annual salary by 20%? More?nnIf you expect this public servant to reduce his pay by 20% then every public employee of the state should be reduced by 20% as well to balance the state budget if that’s what it takes. Any small businessman may be faced with the same SELF IMPOSED salary reduction to keep his business alive. What makes you so special to not have to face the same risks?nn6) Do you believe Bank of America should have been bailed out by taxpayer money, or should BOA been allowed to go out of business?nnI was against ALL stimulus. In a true free market that bohemian of a corporation should have been left for dead just like all the other financial institutions that put us in this position. In a true free market the weak die off and the strong survive. If the government would have stayed out of the way we would have crashed already and we would have been able to now build back up. But this government is holding up a market that was fraudulent to begin with and they are still trying to hold up this walking zombie. Btw, MrMustard1 did you know that Bernanke has been pumping $4 billion dollars a day into the market? With all this phony money printing did you know this is why the dollar is worth less and that is why you are seeing gas and food prices continually go up? The middle class will be destroyed at the rate this administration is destroying our economy on a daily basis.nn7) General Motors posted a profit this year and are giving bonuses. Why?nnBecause they live off of the government teet and their bogus accounting. Thank Obummer and his passion to gain union votes. Why should the union workers get special healthcare treatment as well? Why are taxpayers paying for their special deals? Because Obummer votes are more important than what is right for America. If we were going to invest $60 billion into that dead corporation why not build cars that were NOT run off gas and invest the money creating new jobs creating the infrastructure for real alternative energies and the energy stations needed to fuel these new type of vehicles? That would have been REAL progress but the dumbarse in the White House really has no plan other that to destroy America and turn it into his Marxist vision.nnAlso I disagreed to keep people on unemployment for so long as well. Too many Americans expect the government to take care of them. This only weakens our country with these weak minded people.nnDid I answer your questions clearly enough?nnBtw, I trade for a living plus own 2 other businesses so I’m in the market everyday putting my balls on the line with MY OWN money. I don’t ask for handouts and I don’t look for handouts. What I do do is study hard to always get better at what I do. Do you?nn

Unions are not the fault of jobs being shipped overseas. Millionaire CEOS and millionaire/billionaire boards of directors beholden to Wall Street Shareholders are. These jobs were shipped to countries where there are no workers rights and also unsafe working conditions. What US Worker would go to work for 2 or 3 dollars per hour? The answer is NONE. The true American patriot millionaires cry about how unfair their taxes are (although taxes percentage wise are the LOWEST since WWII) while also trying to fund 2 wars. Tax Cut and Spend! Awesome. Makes perfect sense. Go attack teachers unions. My wife is a teacher with her Master’s Degree, and I have never seen anyone more passionate about their job. Granted I am biased, but her passion for educating Jr. High School students was one thing that impressed me from our very first date. I can guarantee you that she and her fellow teachers are far from lazy and greedy. Also, one things unions do are protect teachers from personal grievances. The school board president cannot stand one of the teacher’s due to a personal issue that has nothing to do with anything at school. One of the best teachers at this school, and the board president was overheard out one night “I wish there was a way to fire that B*&CH, but I can’t without the stupid union stepping in”. Why? He cannot stand her ex-husband. That is his problem with her, her ex-husband. Her classes are always among the top performers in the area!!!!!!!!!!!! Yet he wants nothing more than to fire her over a personal matter. Ridiculous.

Yes….but do you?

Yes my wife, a union teacher with a Master’s Degree, is certainly at the bottom of the educational level.n

You do realize that union workers pay into their benefits, pensions, etc, right? They also pay taxes too, if you weren’t aware of that.

If unions are formed in the private sector that is one thing. There should be NO unions for public employees of any kind.nnIf a private corps wants to deal with unions let them. They can then take the risk of corporate destruction because of it since they are the ones negotiating their own deals.

I hear what you are saying. I agree its not so much the teachers pensions as it is the administrators who structure the pensions. Its way too top heavy and the deals are way too sweet for those administrators. But it is those deals that are putting the states underwater economically speaking.

If the government and it’s services have become so burdensome for you, how about you send your kids to a private school you probably can’t afford (stay out of good public schools with silly union teachers), opt out of taking social security whenever you decide to retire (because you won’t need that will you? Probably not, you invested wisely I’m sure), don’t ever try to call 9-1-1 if you’re in trouble (God forbid those union cops which are a government service come help you) and lastly tell the next member of the military you meet “Thanks, but no thanks for protecting my country, I just think government services are too burdensome now.” nnOpen your eyes, get involved and get educated on what’s happening in this country. States are cutting education, busting up unions, attacking the civil rights of multiple groups of people all for the mighty dollar. nnIf we decide to not do anything, our children and grandchildren are going to suffer from our generation’s ignorance.

I’m a teacher who moved from Washington State with unions to Arizona with no/ineffective unions since it’s a right-to-work state. The differences in pay and benefits are unbelievable. I am currently making $15/hr, down from $34/hr plus benefits for my 19+ years of experience. Basically, I’m a volunteer. No computers that worked in my science classroom, so I bought one.

And Taylor Mali, I love you! I bought your poetry CDs and book several years ago and used them often with my fellow staff in Washington State!

Everybody seems to forget that if it weren’t for teachers there would be no lawyers, politicians, firemen, doctors, nurses, etc. We are the foundation for everything that comes after. Why should we be considered the low man on the totem pole?

So as I asked: If workers (even government workers) wish to form a union, how do you stop them without violating their First Amendment rights?

Are you a public or private union? I could care less about private corp unions and GM isn’t one of them since they are now owned by the government.nnSharon you obviously no next to nothing economically and its clear you have no idea why states are going bankrupt.nnSounds like you’re the angry one too.

You’re an idiot. Simple as that.

You just don’t get the economical destruction of public unions. That’s the point dude. It looks like in your district you need to get rid of the worthless administrators that won’t do their jobs correctly. Why can’t they be fired or is it we tax payers have to buy into hearing “They are just too busy to do their job correctly”?

I don’t disagree with what you posted but its the public pensions that are economically killing the states. Its a simple fact. nnlol….I have nothing against teachers at all. I do not like the fact that the bad teachers can hide behind tenure and their union.nnAnd my parents, since they are retired educators, agree with my point of view.

Because unscrupulous administrators can screw him if he doesn’t have backup.

That’s a bunch of crap but I do agree about administrators. They are to blame for the out of control pensions. That money should go for the students not the administrators pensions.

What’s that have to do with public unions?

No I don’t but I can also see you don’t use your brain much either huh?

Then by your account we should just build private bathroom stall for all students to go into the and learn in solitude…lol

obviously you don’t have as much knowledge that you make everyone believe. My question was rhetorical because she does know how much she gave up but that also means she gave up her life to benefit the masses. That was the point. She didn’t get caught up in the issues in the courtroom when a lot of your morals are thrown out to win a battle. Do you even have kids to make your arguments? Most parents already complain that they have to spend $25, $50, or even more than $100 per school year depending on the child’s grade level. They would be very reluctant to always have to be asked to provide more money to the classroom. They already fight the issue of spending $50 on a field trip to the Barrier Islands that my wife has organized as an annual field trip for the 3rd grade. I have been on this same trip on a personal level and it is well worth the money for what you get out of the experience. She chooses to spend on items to make learning fun. She realized that teaching shouldn’t be just from a book but from hands-on teaching. Her kids wrap themselves around the outside-the-box thinking she provides in her classroom. Her parents marvel at the fact that she can get their child to want to learn and to want to go to school each day. She knows that if she just “read” from the book, her students wouldn’t learn much and wouldn’t have the opportunity to grow in knowledge. I’m sure you can reflect on those teachers you had as a child and remember how bored you were sitting at your desk. She doesn’t have that in her classroom. She consistently makes her students better by the end of the year and the proof is in the pudding with the test scores. She never has the cream of the crop students either because of her special ed background. In fact, she is given a lot of the students that are towards the bottom. She will always have them on or above grade level by the time they leave her classroom. She even has a request list each year from parents and fellow teachers to have their child placed in her classroom. If that doesn’t speak volumes, nothing will. Back to her spending, just like my company, most anyone in the workforce is provided with practically endless supplies of everyday items needed to perform their job. She teaches in one of the top school districts in our state. If we have such a rich district, then why would there be a limit on paper, copying, etc. put on these teachers? That wasn’t her choice. We own our own copier so that she can run copies at home for her classroom. If you say she shouldn’t spend, then her kids would be the best thumb twiddlers in the world!!! Open your eyes and realize that a lot of teachers go well above what they are asked to do and get very little in return in support from people like you. If you do in fact have kids, I fear for whatever teachers they would have because they are at a lose-lose situation from day one.

lol….try the same. Citizens United is a non profit organization. They have nothing to do with establishing who is a corporate entity and who is not. Duh….the IRS does though.

as a husband of a teacher, THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!

You’re right.. we don’t. In other professions we have the proper procedures to weed out the bad fruits. We have a review process where employees are rewarded on merit and not by how many years they have served. The cream rises to the top.nnIf this guys is as good as he says he is, I say pay him what he deserves

Bohemian corporation? Is that a corporation that runs beatnik coffee shops? Inquiring minds want to know!

Oh, I’m sorry I meant behemoth but I understand you are too mentally challenged to get the point….lol

God Bless Teachers!

Public workers are public servants. Tax payers pay their salaries. As a tax payer I do not want my services disrupted because of public union hostage taking. Gees maybe our solders that protect our country should start a new union huh?nnBut hey I guess school administrators should certainly be worth more than the heroes that protect our country right?

If only more than three of the sixty or so teachers I knew as a child had the pride in their work that this guy seems to, I wouldn’t have been as traumatised and emotionally destroyed by the experience of going through school as I was.nSadly, from my experience, he is talking for a small minority, as most of the “teachers” who taught me were egotistical, small-minded, petty bullies, who refreshed their own egos at the expense of mine: a pathetic, trembling ten year old who couldn’t defend himself and ended up being treated in a children’s mental hospital for depression and anxiety because of them, and was a social inadequate with no life skills for at least ten years afterward.nI would have been far happier and less damaged if they had shut their belittling, confidence-eviscerating mouths and just beaten me.nnYeah, teachers can make not just a difference, but a DIFFERENCE – but they can also wound and destroy. And sadly, some of them not only seem to try to do so, but go out of their way to do a powerful job of it.nnIf you’re a teacher reading this, please remember that. Next time you think a child is being difficult because they’re purposely trying to bugger your day up, maybe it’s just because they have a learning difficulty. Maybe under that incompatibility with the incredibly narrow teaching system they’re trying to be shoe-horned into, they’re actually trying to shelter an IQ that would sail through the MENSA entrance test, and maybe your shortness of temper and your lack of patience and foresight could condemn them to a life of academic mediocrity and a decade of having an emotional age fifteen years lower than their physical one.

Where does everyone get the idea that teachers have tenure? A teacher that doesn’t do his/her job can and should be non-renewed (fired). Administrators do have to do their job and document when an employee is not performing as they should. If a person is non-renewed the union will make sure that the worker’s rights are followed but the union is not there to save him. Teachers are proud of their profession and do not want to work with people who are lazy. Most teachers who don’t have the skills needed to teach are let go in the first couple of years. You need to quit listening to the media and go to your school districts and find out what is really going on. Some of you are misinformed. Administrators who say they can’t get rid of a bad teacher are not doing their job. If that excuse is used, maybe your school district has a lazy administrator.

This is total blather – you make no sense at all.rnBig deal – you’re angry…but your anger is directed at all the wrongrnpeople. Teachers did not cause the problems of this country, nor didrnpolicemen, firemen, unions of any kind.rnrnDid you just happen to duck out and miss the BUSH years 2000-2008 when arnsurplus was handed over on a silver platter to the Republicans? Did theyrnreduce spending and keep an eye on Wall Street – especially after Enronrnunraveled early on in full sight?rnNopetty-nope-nope-nope!rnThey nearly ran our economy into a full-scale depression – ordinary people’srnlife savings and jobs – poof! The Corporate Off-shore tax havens,rnexecutives’ million dollar bonuses, wealthy tax-dodgers and Wall Strnshenanigans are where you should be pointing your finger and raging.rnrnDid you miss Bush chuckling to his elite donors at a fund-raiser, “Welcomernto the *Haves!* and the Have-*Mores*!” Are you so lacking of an originalrnidea that you only see what the Glenn Becks and Rush Limbaughs spew, – thatrnit’s the fault of the *Middle Class worker,* (that’s me bub), that therneconomy is in the state it’s in?rnrnThe Republican strategy has always been to plant the most offensive andrnoutrageous lies about a perceived enemy (the Democrats, middle class,rnliberal, etc.) so as to deflect blame from their own mistakes. However, itrnseems they’ve gone totally off the deep end this time and the quiet middlernclass is not sitting back any longer.rnrnIf you have anything intelligent to reply, I am happy to discuss, otherwise,rngo spew somewhere else…rnrnrn On Sat, Mar 19, 2011 at 2:11 PM, Disqus <

Well, Ms. Raymer $55,000 for 9 mos of work is not a bad return a little over $6,000 a month. I believe you show your “Elite” attitude in your thinking of down grading someone that might be a blue collar… You quote, your master’s ..yes, a master’s from 1986 followed by no other education since then. You could be a lazy UNION teacher most likely.nnI believe the joke is on your FLA school district about a teacher that likes to WHINE about after 27 years !!!!I “An I have not made it to the Adm. yet.”.there is a reason you may be too lazy as a UNION teacher to even be thought of for adm. office., or the Elite “white collar” you want so bad!!! nnYour a 3 grade teacher…not a professional with a CURRENT advanced degree..

This is a performance, not a social studies lesson. In the scenario of this performance, Mali is acting out his response to a dinner guest who mocked the low salary and supposed lack of ability of teachers.nnAnd parents DO have a say in who educates their kids! They can homeschool. They can pony up the bucks and pay for private school. Or, if public education is the choice that fits a parent’s finances, location, religious beliefs, whatever..they must PARTICIPATE. They can vote in school board elections for candidates who closely match their own political views. They can volunteer in their children’s classrooms, or if working hours prevent this, show up in the evening at sporting events, plays, Open House night, the Principal’s coffee hour, and so on. They can meet the staff. They can make sure when class lists are being drawn up that they advocate for the teacher who best fits their child’s needs. (Unless of course, they are believers in the credo that every teacher is a bad teacher, or at least, every teacher that works in a unionized district.) nnPublic education is one of the best deals around. n

Whether you agree with David Cale or not I ask you to take a look at his grammar and spelling America. It is basically flawless and far superior to most other comments I see written here and other places on the web and in society. His education seems to have served him pretty well thus far.

No one ever made them read Moby Dick.nn

As a teacher myself, it’s a joy to read your defense of my profession. Bravo!!! Thank you very much. I laugh when I think how those who patter on about the state of our system of education could not last 1 year in front of a high school class. For the businessmen/women out there…imagine having to lead a conference every single day of your working career. No, I take that back…imagine having to lead 6 conferences back-to-back every single day. Then imagine having to make those conferences enjoyable for the participants, having to make sure that the participants actually learned something during the hour you were leading said conference. The life of a teacher isn’t defined by their pay. But don’t you think more capable people would join the ranks, if only the profession was shown some respect. There are countries in this world where a teacher is as valuable as a doctor or a lawyer. Teachers in the U.S. would dearly love to be shown that type of respect one day.

I’m intrigued by your answer to that first question.nnI’ll just assume you are against some forms of financial aid for higher education, like Pell grants, as that stance seems to fall in line with your previous points (work for yourself and take no handouts). nnLet’s say I’m poor and pay for my education out of pocket. I go to a community college, a state university, and then a credential program. Bargain education, all the way, living very responsibly throughout. However, these costs have skyrocketed due to inflation (I paid $950 my first semester at my CSU, and students this semester pay nearly $3000).nnSince I had to use loans to pay for a substantial portion of my education, how on earth am I going to pay those off with a salary of 30-40K a year? nnAt that kind of pay rate, people who *want* to teach can’t without swimming in debt for a good chunk of their lives.nnYes, if you want to make a great deal of money, you probably should go into the private sector, as that is what is going to net you a better paycheck right now.nnBut who *will* teach if we make it even more difficult to survive on teaching wages? nnWho will teach your children when the classrooms are more crowded than they are now? nnWhat will we do as a nation when the best and the brightest who were willing to teach no longer *can* because they can’t survive on such wages after such an investment in education? nnYes, it’s a choice to teach. It’s a choice that qualified people need to be making if we value our future at all. But if we live in a society that devalues teaching (both socially and economically), some people who would be fantastic teachers are probably less likely to make that choice. And that is *our* loss. Maybe the lost teacher’s gain in financial flexibility. But *our* loss.nnOn a related note, I just don’t understand how large groups of people in this country can vilify public programs while supporting policy that makes it more difficult to survive with a reasonable standard of living (not a high one, just reasonable).nnWhat do you think will happen if women can’t get access to family planning and then have no way of supporting their children (WIC, anyone?) Do you expect them to die in the streets because they cannot get the help they need? I’m sorry, I’m not going to call a single mother lazy and an example of someone who should be weeded out because even working two part time minimum wage jobs (if she can find them, and without insurance!) she can barely feed her family.nnYou don’t think we’ll see spikes in crime as people resort to desperate measures to survive? What, do we put everyone in jail? Let them fight it out on the streets?nnWhat do you think is going to happen if we keep on like this? Yea, we need to reevaluate public programs. They absolutely can be done better. But getting rid of them? Ack. This shift in attitude toward anything public and not related to ME ME ME is terrifying.

1. I’m not just “showing up” for my “9 months” I’m working my butt off for it (I average between 70-80 hours of work each week during the school year) which estimating on the low end (70) I’d be averaging over 48 hours a week and on average getting paid less than most 40 hour a week jobs. I am after school helping students that struggle with my subject most nights until 5pm.n2. Those 3 months off you talk about, I wish we didn’t have them, it isn’t wise for the students’ brains retaining knowledge or for the consistency of practice within a classroom for anyone. However even the way it is I spend 3-4 weeks each summer doing training for classes and changes in the course and school and am changing and altering some of my lessons and taking classes to improve my teaching.n3. The union contract covers us from false accusations from students or their parents about anything. If I didn’t have a union contract a student could claim I didn’t like him simply because of a low score on a quiz or test and I would be fired, regardless of the truth of the matter.nnSo I guess you’re correct, I show up at 8am sit around until 3pm and then go home and do nothing and just sleep all summer. Going into teaching had NOTHING to do with trying to help students academically, emotionally or with matters of respect which many of them are not getting from their parents unfortunately.nnHave a wonderful day.

I agree whole-heartedly with plozar.nnI worked for fifteen years in private business before becoming a teacher. During those years, I always worked hard and did my best. Then, about fifteen years ago, I decided to become a teacher because I wanted to make a positive difference in the lives of children. I have, now, been teaching for twelve years. During that time, I have worked harder and longer hours than I ever worked before, all because I believe our children deserve our very best. What I do is not anything unusual. I don’t know any teachers who don’t do the same. People who criticize teachers think they know what teaching is like but they really don’t.

Wow. One of the reasons we rank below other countries is the fact that public schools in America educate all children across the spectrum, This includes the senior in high school with cognitive disabilities who has no verbal skills and is fed by an aide and who wears diapers. In other countries these children are not educated. They are tracked at an early age and sometimes institutionalized or left on the street to beg. In other countries teachers are held in high esteem by all members of society. They are the “Nation Builders” who educate the future plumbers, carpenters, doctors, nurses, manufacturing laborers, the social workers, the counselors, the teachers, the retail workers etc.,, nnThis fight for collective bargaining is not about the money. It is about rights. Why do you think that the union firefighters and police who will not be penalized monetarily have stood by our side at the capitol week in and week out? They are maintaining their collective bargaining rights and yet they protest in solidarity against a bully governor who thinks it’s OK to give millions of dollars worth of tax breaks to his corporate buddies and pick on the middle class. This is class warfare.nnAs a teacher who has worked with at-risk high school students for the past 19 years in Wisconsin….and has another 23 years of experience working in the private sector in non-union retail, restaurant and DNR positions….I have found in my personal experience that at whatever job, I’ve had…there may be a few slackers. It is unfair to judge an entire profession on a few undesirables. As teachers, we earn our pay and we get paid 25% less than private jobs with similar educational requirements and experience. It has never been about the money. Our pension is part of our benefit package. We earned the money and we take it in lieu of a higher paycheck. We do pay a portion of our health care costs as well. I net about $24,000 a year. That’s with 19 years experience, a Master’s degree with 24 additional credits and five licenses. I haven’t even paid off all of my school loans yet. As teachers we pay taxes. We help move the economy. By removing 6% of our income, the Wisconsin economy will suffer.nnUnfortunately, the media hasn’t gotten this story quite right. It isn’t just about teachers….it’s about prison guards, hospital doctors and nurses, plow drivers and on and on and on.

Once again, discussion of important policy matters gets stupified by the perversion of terms into buzzwords. Oh, UNIONS are the problem with America’s balance books, dirty UNIONS, no-good money-grubbing UNIONS– as though spitting the word in allcaps will turn it into something nefarious. Like LIBERALS.nnWell let’s make it a little more challenging for ‘em. Let’s refer to the unions by their other name- something a little longer and harder to spell; at least then we can have a laugh at them when they fuck it up. Professionals’ collective bargaining organizations. Where, pray tell, do the UNION-deriding simpletons think we/they/everyone will end up if professionals’ collective bargaining organizations are abolished? How do they think their own rights as workers will hold up if the corporations- whose *only,* singular guiding ethic is maximum profit- are given totally free reign over their workforces? How much do they trust their own bosses not to f**k them and then sell the tape for a few more dollars? What do they think they’ll get paid if there are no collective bargaining organizations trying to get them a fair deal with reasonable terms and equitable compensation? Do they expect that- out of the goodness of their hearts- upper management won’t block the fire exits with more cubicles full of people making a fraction of what minimum wage used to be? Do they think that shareholders will fight for their vacation time or their overtime pay?nnI think the problem these people have is a failure of imagination; they don’t have the capacity to envision what things *could* be like (specifically how much worse they could be) so they just respond- un-thoughtfully- to what charismatic figures or their ideological leaders tell them.

Where were your parents while this was happening?

Thank you, Taylor! My Dad was one of the best teachers I ever had!nHe taught me Chemistry and Physics and, I loved it so much that, I majored in Chemistry in college and did graduate studies in physical biochemistry. He was strict and disciplined, and he worked hard for his students! Thank God for teachers like my Dad!

I Loved everything he said minus the profanity. What passion!

Wow! Great impact!

This was worth watching…and then some…

9 Months.. seriously? Just because school is out for summer doesn’t mean that we teachers take that time off too. Some of us do continuing education (required by some states to keep your credential, all PAID BY US), some teach summer school, summer student programs, sports, band camp, etc. And the kicker is our salaries don’t go up ONE CENT to do these things, we have to PAY for them ourselves and invest the time ourselves… because it is WHO WE ARE and WHAT WE DO for YOUR children… nnTry being in a classroom for one week, plan the lessons, attend the staff meetings, discipline the students, and be successful at disseminating information to them in an appropriate and equitable manner following all federal (NCLB), state (Frameworks, Content Standards), and local (district directives/standards) rules and guidelines. Oh, and you HAVE to have a 4 year degree (that’s a Bachelor’s Degree) AND a Teaching Credential valid in the state in which you teach (roughly two more years of school and training). Next time you call a teacher LAZY or are so SURE their unions will keep them regardless, you should see what they do for YOUR children before you criticize. People in glass houses… just saying.

This is in response to what people wrote about unions. I have been a teacher for ten years and am in a union. I was RIF’d last April. My position was eliminated. (I had worked at the same school for nine years.) So, it is not true that teachers still cannot lose their jobs when in unions.

I am a union teacher. I have been teaching for 12 years and make $38,000. I pay $550 each month toward my healthcare/benefits, and about $175 each month goes toward my own retirement. Pretty sure that doesn’t equal a “fat cat” teacher who wants their benefits GIVEN to them. I would guess that most of you posting on here make more than I do and don’t work half as hard.

I am a union teacher. I have been teaching for 12 years and make $38,000. I pay $550 each month toward my healthcare/benefits, and about $175 each month goes toward my own retirement. Pretty sure that doesn’t equal a “fat cat” teacher who wants their benefits GIVEN to them. I would guess that most of you posting on here make more than I do and don’t work half as hard.

As a teacher I find all these arguments both infuriating and amusing. People who have no idea criticize. The utter BS of saying it is ok for corporations to not only donate to politicians, but also manipulate public policy is absurd. Teachers’ unions should have a say in education policy. Would you ask an astronaut to make decisions regarding child birth or heart surgery? No, because while they are highly educated, they are not experts in the field of obstetrics or cardiology. Teachers are EXPERTS at what they do and a HUGE part of what is wrong with education policy in this country is that educators are NOT consulted or involved in setting that policy. You want to know what works- ask a teacher. You want to know how to make kids better learners- ask a teacher. nnThe other issue I find so absurd is the argument that unions are protecting bad teachers and that is why they should be abolished. I have been teaching now for 14 years and have worked in 4 districts. Yes, there are teachers whom are not good at their job but mostly I find that the unions are there to protect good teachers from issues that arise with parents and administrators. One teacher I know personally had a kid accuse her of physically assaulting him. His parents filed a police report and his mother came unglued. A week later he admitted that he lied because he was mad that the teacher kept him in to finish an assignment during recess (God forbid- he was being held ACCOUNTABLE!!!). The teacher would have faced criminal charges on her record if it had not been for the protection of our union.nnI think we need more teachers in this country like Taylor Mali who will get up in your face and tell you the truth. In my experience though it is teachers like him that will need the protection of the union more than anyone else. Never mind that his kids are focused and work hard. Never mind that his test scores are probably high (and that’s what counts right?). He speaks the truth and parents and administrators, more often than not, do not want to hear it. nnAs a teacher I want my students to be challenged and to broaden their world view. To find excitement in working out a problem. To see beauty in a drop of pond water or the stroke of a paint brush. I don’t think I should have to trade these amazing things for poor wages, inadequate benefits, and no job security. I don’t think I should have to spend my own money to buy the essential tools my “employees” need to do their job (Can you imagine a hospital asking a surgeon to pay for his own scalpels?) Why is it that the public’s attitude seems to be that because I chose to teach I am supposed to do it with the goodness of my heart and not expect compensation in return? If that were the case, why not tell politicians that because they chose public service they will not be paid or have benefits?nnNo one should criticize what they don’t understand. I won’t use the old saying that if you want to know what teaching is like go volunteer in a classroom. Please don’t. One day shows you NOTHING. You won’t understand dong it 5 days a week, correcting papers on weekends, working after hours and sacrificing your time, energy and money, heart and soul. You won’t understand paying to take state mandated “professional development” classes out of your own pocket and spending 4 Saturdays listening to lecturers tell you things you already know. You don’t have to understand but it would be nice if you could stop treating public school teachers like they are pariah in this society.

oh, I failed to repsond about you saying she should leave teaching because she’s unhappy. Not once did I mention that she was unhappy in her job. I’m smart enough to know that a master’s degree doesn’t automatically get you $100k a year. Don’t know where you come up with your rants becasue you definitely have no clue when you start up on people. nIt shows your lack of education in the fact of all your postings you don’t know the difference in word usage.nHere are some of the words you misuse over and over and I know you aren’t smart enough to deliverately do it either:nnYour and you’renThere, Their, they’renPrinciple and principal.nusing “a” and not “an”nnsimple grammatical errors that a highly educated person like you should know how to use. nNOW, you should definitely be the one thanking all the hard working teachers for making sure children know the differences in word usage. nMaybe your lack of quality education has made you the way you are and have to belittle ALL teachers. n

Yes, the surplus was there for W, and was gone very quick, but President Obama has done nothing but SPEND money for no purpose what is the national debt at $14,000,000,000,000.00 the “Ivory Tower President” that he is he does not care one bit about the “Middle Class” as Jenne-d-Arc stated she is part of an so happy with the “Do Nothing President”. He is giving the tax cuts to the rich so it sounds like Regan which is another story it its self…nnThe contrast with Joan of Arc as your not aware…you have a life with no faith in your “Ivory Tower” listening to NPR, and not applying any life experiences to life, and do you help people? It is pretty clear your very self-centered regarding Jennen. Good luck…

David Cale,,,statements are “flawless” well yes, he does not have to work!! He is part of the “Ivory Tower Educators” looking down on us….He is AWARD WINNING…think there might be a little ego problem there etc.., He has stated that a few times I believe,nnIf he was not such a UNION teacher, and an individual that was working, and worrying about the house payments, the utilities, elderly parents, taxes, cost of gas, HIV medications and side effects, if the car will make it another year ( God what is that noise from under the hood), the cost of basic food…(eggs bananas) etc.. And we had ALL day to sit around with our awards…the grammar would be perfect etc.., Then you as a “Ivory Tower Person” would be happy…the blog would be perfect…..Good luck!!!

Obama is number one…is your life any better since he took office?? Just a thought!!!

SD Trader….your spelling is atrocious. You must have had horrible teachers. Maybe that is where your anger is coming from. Principal not principle. Know not no. Your ideas are as thoughtful as your spelling is correct.

Your attitude is what has caused the destruction of American educational system. Complete lack of respect for any education. Is being stupid that much fun? Your kid has an F? Probably because they didn’t do their homework, didn’t study, and is more inclined to blame others for their laziness. Easier to blame a teacher for a lazy kid than hold the kid acccountable. This runs rampant on both sides of the political fence. (R) families are just as guilty of coddling their kids as (D) families. Unions protect teachers from uneducated politicians and people like you. I make far less than I would in any other field, with the same education required. But, I teach in a public school. Not because I can’t do “real work”, but because I can (and have) and I want my students to be able to as well. If you think my job isn’t real work, you should spend a day in my classroom. You have no idea what real work is.

Well said young man!

I have no problem with paying soldiers more for their service in protecting the Constitution. Our rights are fragile, after all: there are too many people out there who seem to think that what they want should supersede other people’s Constitutional rights.nnSpeaking of which: If workers (even government workers) wish to form a union, how do you stop them without violating their First Amendment rights?nn(EDIT: I thought this would post below SDTrader’s last reply, not above it. There’s no “Reply” button on these comments, I guess because they’re too deep in the thread.)

What a great post! Thank you for even asking! The $30k-$40 example was based off living in WI. Living in CA ( I’m only assuming since I identify with CSU being from CA ) at that amount would no doubt be extremely difficult. nnI also feel the pain for the students that have had their tuition fees raised to such a higher level. The plight of younger people is a difficult path based off of the economic conditions we now face. Their future is a challenge for sure. nnUnfortunately we have an administration that is either completely ignorant to economics or is trying to complete the plan to transform this country to, at best, a European Socialist country. As an American one must see the writing on the wall or suffer long term consequences. And btw, if you are suffering long term consequences so am I. We are in the same boat.nnAs a by product of educators, I can only relate the love my folks had for their profession and their students. It was never about how much money they made but what they accomplished in their career. Sure I never had the material crap that most kids had but I sure knew I was loved. That’s also what they gave their students and the ones who really never experience real love at home were unbelievably grateful for the love their teacher showed them at school. That’s what is was about for them. nnThat was an extremely high example of teachers that lived their passion of education. What if every teacher took that example and lived it? Would you think your kids would have a good chance to excel? They also went to night school to finish their Master’s degrees while raising my sister and I. We did not grow up whining about our lives. nnshadeofgray, the problems we face really falls on school administrators greed. They end up with the cushy pensions and the teachers receive much less. Its the power of the unions that negotiate these deals benefiting the upper echelon of education. They use the power of the union’s vote to intimidate politicians for votes. Its a very sick process and the well meaning teacher is caught in the middle of this pathetic greed, whether it be money or power.nnIf there should be a distribution of wealth why don’t we start comparing administrator salaries and pensions versus teachers? Really how much more should an administrator make versus a teacher? There is no doubt that teachers work more hours than administrators with all the work they take home.nnThe unions are killing off good teachers because the leaders are only in it for themselves and the power they can wield. Teachers are only pawns in the system. Until each individual teacher realizes this instead of drinking the union Kool-Aid the trend will only continue.nnMy only advice is to live within your means or look to broaden your skills to create additional revenue for yourself. There is no easy answer except for the time being you still live in a country that you can use your voice to change the obvious cliff we are heading over with the leadership we now have.nnYou ask very thought provoking and real life questions. I commend you for that! nnWhat will happen at the rate we are going? Will we see spikes in crime as people resort to desperate measures to survive? nnAbsolutely….unfortunately. Look at the Japanese in their crisis. Do you actually think Americans could treat each other in the same respect? Sadly but hardly. It is a me me me society but doesn’t leadership start from the top? Who do we have has a genuine leader? One who could care less for himself and more about making decisions for the greater good? nnWithout sounding political I believe Ron Paul is that type of individual. But unfortunately shallow Americans are sold by marketing and charisma. Ron Paul lacks charisma. If Americans focused on the message and not the marketing of a candidate we would have competent officials in leadership positions. nnAs an example look at Obummer and his wife. In the worst economical conditions I’ve ever experienced, I’m 54 yrs old, look how they have showered themselves in perks. Look at the people they hired to assist them. 32 czars for him and 21 assistants for her. Hillary Clinton only had 3. Laura Bush had 1. Does she really need 21 assistants? We know he hired the czars to transform his sick vision of America. What kind of example have they shown us? Do you think they have shown they can even relate to the normal person trying to survive at this time? Is this the type of leadership you can admire and respect?nnIf they had any resemblance to be able to relate, we would see behavior that would display the opposite of their opulence. nnWhat we really need is for Americans to be strong not weak. Look for ways of independence not dependence on government. Americans have become lazy in their microwave existence. Maybe it will take the unaware sheep to lose their microwaves to get how much of their freedoms they continue to give up for their precious entitlement programs and me me me microwaves. For true progress government is not the answer. Smaller government will create more progress but the people have to get it. There has to be a change in social consciousness.nnOur Founding Father’s gave up everything they owned to create this great country. How many Americans would do that now? Most will succumb to Big Brother just to have a chance to keep their junk. What is freedom? Do Americans really know? No they don’t. Why? Because they never have lived in a time that only has had a rich class and a poor class. Mexico is a great example. Corrupt politicians and a society with no middle class. Is there any doubt as to why they come to the US?nnSo where are Americans going to go when they have allowed their country to become a Mexico? nnI suggest you stay active in how your profession operates and to stand against the administration’s deals if they keep doing top heavy deals. Stand up as a real teacher’s union and make your voice heard to your administrators. Most teachers and union workers just go along to get along. Too bad fear dominates.nnI have to say that is exactly why I chose to run my life based on my on knowledge, wisdom, and abilities and to only depend on what I can create not the government or anyone else for that matter.nnAs I said there needs to be a change in our social consciousness. Capitalism with all its warts is far greater than any socialist country. Our innovations from America are a perfect example. When was the last great invention that came out of the UK or Europe? Was it the Beatles?nnI wish you the best. But stay involved and keep your head high!

The commenters who condemn unions got trickled.nFrom Roosevelt into Nixon we had the strongest unions in our history. We built the most powerful military, the richest economy, and the most mobile society, and won the biggest war, that the world had ever known. And we rebuilt our allies… and our enemies!

And please explain how unions accomplish such a noble thing?

Because its the weak administrators allowing themselves to be intimidated by those worthless parents.

lol….actually I did. nnSorry you are too ignorant to get the message. nnIf you sense any anger its towards morons like you that that are too lazy and fearful to find out how we got ourselves into this economical mess and would rather criticize grammar versus understanding the message.nnMake sure to stay home in November of 2012. We need intelligent people at the polls.

My life is better. I’m not sure if it has anything to do with Obama. But yeah, my life is better than it was two years ago. If yours isn’t, Gosh I’m sorry.

nbig business has billions to influence EVERYTHING. Unions just dont have the money no matter what you think. my dues for an entire year is 480.00 as a union Ironworker. i pay work assesments based on hours worked that amount to maybe another 1000.00 for the year if i work all year and that barely keeps the lights on. we dont have anyone in the office that isnt needed and they all work 50 or more hours a week getting paid for 40. my dues have gone from 32.00 15 years ago to 40.00 while my wages more than make up for the increase. i completed an 8000 hour apprenticeship earning several certifications that allow me not only to call myself a journeyman Ironworker but guarentee my wage. I am my master not another union member and I control my future by staying engaged and involved with not only my union but my neighborhood,city,county,state,and federal ELECTIONS. Unions did create the middle class and it is exactly what keeps wages fair…competition for skilled workers. without unions you all will be competing for the same jobs with whoever is willing to do it the cheapest “winning” your way to the bottom-people will move away for something better…a futurenn

Ummm… to what professions do you refer? Doctors, who protect their own? Lawyers, who protect their own? Police officers, who protect their own? Hedge fund managers, who protect their own? Wall Street execs, who protect their own?nWhere are all these bad teachers to whom you refer? I’m not a teacher, but I’ve seen many more bad parents than bad teachers. Maybe some of these self-centered parents just look for an excuse to not examine their parenting skills, and so blame the teachers. Many bad students will also blame the teacher rather than look at themselves with anything resembling honesty. Teachers didn’t tank the economy; don’t ship jobs overseas, and haven’t started expensive wars- that was done by people who denigrate teachers.

First, no one is ‘pinning’ the poor economy on teachers, or even their unions. The action in Wisconsin learns from our mistakes (of allowing politicians to place unservicable burdens on the future tax payor) and make corrective action to the framework.nnSecond, the performance gap between our children and children of third world countries has narrowed over the last 40 years. Our children have experienced a diminishing result after the creation of a Department of Education (Thank you, Jimmy Carter). During this same period, the ‘living wage’ of teachers have improved in real terms.nnThe changes in Wisconsin are logical.

I have yet to meet anyone who went into teaching for the money or the job security. I have known people who have left teaching because the pay was too low for the amount of work they were doing, and could make much more in the private sector while working less. nYou will never, NEVER improve your own life or life condition by denying something to someone else: taking benefits of any kind from union workers makes it much less likely you will ever get any of those benefits you envy. The whole purpose of a union is to gather together in strength to obtain something you couldn’t get on your own. I support union activity because I want better wages and working conditions for myself and everybody else, and it is easier to point to an example for an employer to emulate (or feel threatened by) than to “reinvent the wheel”.nPS Many comments below are by “Heylookingfor”:nA. Heylookingfor: Please learn the difference between ‘there’, ‘they’re’, and ‘their’. Your comments are often muddled due to there- er- no, they’re, wait- no, I mean THEIR misuse of these so-confusing words (sarcasm intended).nB. Anyone reading Heylookingfor’s comments will see union as UNION. You can often substitute the word CORPORATE/CORPORATION and the comment still works.nC. I have heard that some conservative groups will “salt” threads like this with comments slamming liberal/progressive/Democratic ideas and principles, pretending to be “normal citizens” when they are actually paid to insert those “facts” into threads. That wouldn’t be you, would it Heylookingfor?

This guys a good laugh!… and he is right to be angry. People shouldn’t take their distaste for Unions and place that on teachers themselves (especially generalizing every single teacher). Sure, there are horrid teachers. There are horrid people in every profession. The reason that I do not like the teacher Unions is because it protects those who are the bad apples, (IMO) more than it protects those who are wonderful teachers. If in fact it isn’t MORE, the fact is that it still protects the bad ones, and that isn’t fair to hard working tax payers, or the parents and students who are subjected to it.nnIn any profession where there is not a Union, job performance is what mandates a persons pay, and status. If I work hard, and I am not rewarded for it, I simply look for a different job. This is the way every other person in America goes about their employment. If we are treated badly, we leave, if we are treated well, we stay. If a school system doesn’t treat it’s teachers fairly, they can come together and go before the School Board, they can leave and leave that school system without educators. nnUnions served their purpose. I just don’t see how a teacher, like any other worker in any other profession, cannot “protect” themselves from their employer. It doesn’t make any logical sense. If someone can explain to me why they feel it is necessary to have a Union, I am very curious to hear it. (I mean it sincerely).

“Seestraight” – perhaps you need glasses. Is your retirement in jeopardy? Have you worked for nothing?

Perhaps poor parenting?

Nine months? Sorry to inform you, but our days are much longer than the typical 9-5, the week is much longer than Mon.-Fri. and our “9 mos” is more like a year round job. Please educate yourself and volunteer in a classroom before judging.

It must be really scary for teachers that the deification they have enjoyed for so long is coming to end, and we’re all taking a closer look at their job performance like we do for other professions. Hence, the screaming in that delivery. It’s tough feeling unappreciated, isn’t it Mr. Mali? I am a homeschooling mother of two. And there is not a single teacher’s union in the nation that supports how I have chosen to educate my kids, or trusts me to do the job well. Welcome to my nightmare, Mr. Mali. I enjoy the same treatment at the hands of your unions that you received during your dinner party.

As a relatively new teacher who moved from the legal profession (prosecuting attorney) I am baffled at the references to “union” teachers as “lazy”. I am a “union” teacher; lazy I am not. The union protects a teacher or classroom from the child who threatens or hurts other kids, protects the teacher who has 40 students while the teacher across town has 25, protects a teacher’s right to a 30-minute lunch. The union does not protect a bad teacher’s job- in my time as a teacher, I’ve seen teachers lose their jobs. I pay into my own pension. I pay for my health insurance.I am a public employee, but I earn the money I bring home, just as the police, fire fighters, the person cutting the grass in the public park and the librarian down the street do.nI did not understand the depth of the social problems in this country until I became a teacher. I would ask anyone who believes teachers are “lazy”, “bad” or “overpaid” to spend a week in any urban school district in this country. Nobody can call a teacher lazy until they have spent a week in a room full of eighth graders.nnnnnnnnnnnn

As a relatively new teacher who moved from the legal profession (attorney) I am baffled at the references to “union” teachers as “lazy”. I am a “union” teacher; lazy I am not. The union protects a teacher or classroom from the child who threatens or hurts other kids, protects the teacher who has 40 students while the teacher across town has 25, protects a teacher’s right to a 30-minute lunch. The union does not protect a bad teacher’s job- in my time as a teacher, I’ve seen teachers lose their jobs. The only thing the union protected was their right to due process.n I pay into my own pension, I pay into my own health insurance, and the money I recieve as a public employee, from public funds, is money I have earned, just the same as the police officers, firefighters, librarians and people who cut the lawn in the public park have.nI worked for many years in the private sector; until I became a teacher, I did not fully comprehend the depth of the social problems in this country, which are so brightly reflected in our schools. The problems are not caused by teachers, and cannot be solved by teachers alone. I would ask all of you who believe “union” teachers are “lazy” and just showing up for a paycheck to spend a week- a full week- with a teacher in any urban school in this country. Only then can you even begin to understand what it means to be a teacher- until you experience it first hand, it’s all just other people’s stories.nnnnnnnnnnn

Thank you jadeg93!nFinally someone who is / hasna: educated nb: been there nc: supportive. nThank you !

Thank you- I could not have said it better myself.

In any profession there are some people who will just get by doing the minimum. There are also people who will take pride in what they do, regardless of their pay, and always give 100%. Obviously, not every teacher in America belongs to the latter. However, if you were looking to make good money and slack off, the best choice might not be to spend your life teaching a bunch of inner city 8 year olds for $35k per year. The vast majority of teachers wake up every morning and do the absolute best they can, because they actually care about children and our society. nnI’m not a psychologist, but if you think that someone who chose to teach children how to read a write for a living is a lazy, greedy, bottom feeder, then you might want to look in the mirror. Of course YOU can easily imagine lazy teachers taking advantage of the system, because that is exactly what YOU would do. It’s OK…it’s only natural to think that all human beings are just like you. But take a minute, close your eyes, and try to imagine a world where everyone is not as selfish as you.

The NEA began in 1857. I doubt that blame lies on an organization founded before the Civil War. Perhaps a bit of education is in order.

Maybe you should look into what Finland does for its teachers. They really do appreciate education. The value their youth and they pay for it with free training for the best and brightest to become teachers. As long as this country maintains the lowest pay possible for its teachers we will have poor and inept teachers amongst the good. I we were to weed out those who would not be good and pay those who are good what they deserve all children would benefit. But, we refuse to charge a minority for educating our children. They spend too much money on political control of this country and have been given tax breaks that are bankrupting this country. They are the wealthiest 5% and they owe all of us much more than they are paying in taxes.

Has anyone really thought of the implications of having a widespread closure of public schools due to lack of teachers? How about a nationwide strike? Imagine millions of teenagers running around in your neighborhood all day with nothing to do. Imagine the creative chaos that would ensue. Life as we know it would come to a complete halt. The capacity to meet the demand for childcare simply does not exist nor are there enough private schools to provide the education for all of America’s children. In that sense, teachers make life in America to continue smoothly everyday. Teachers make the economic machine in America continue to run.

You sound like someone who is parroting Glen Beck, who never even went to college. What do you know?nHave you actually tried to live on what a teacher makes? Pah, hatred is all you are and you really don’t know what you are talking about. Go out and join “Teach for America” find out what the job really is.

It is very easy to get rid of bad teachers. It takes a good administrator, but those are few and far between.

No, it is because Americans do not value education.

Yes, teachers, police, firefighters etc are severely under appreciated. Unions are a small percentage of the private sector because the wealthy employers have found a way to convince the ignorant that they do not deserve to make more than they are making.

You, really don’t use your brain much. Just follow what some wealthy idiot tells you is fact.

Wealthy people bought the right to outsource by paying for the election of people who eliminated regulations that made it hard to outsource. That is what destroyed the jobs in this country. Anyone who believes otherwise has been brainwashed by the wealthy elite. They like that, you do the job for them.

Its very clear by your response that you unfortunately were shorted in that area of your body.nnBased off your handle are you tired of yourself yet?

The ignorant huh? What percentage of the working population is ignorant enough to be convinced by the wealthy employers to feel like they do not deserve to make more than they are making?nnDo you fall into that category?nnSince its just a small percentage of intelligent workers that are in unions, then by your deduction the majority of workers must be ignorant right? Like 95% must be ignorant then huh?nnSo then you are basically saying that the overwhelming percentage of American workers are just stupid and ignorant people that are incapable of standing up for themselves or understanding their own self worth in their own life?nnIs that what you are trying to communicate?

You really can’t be a teacher now are you? If so, God help your students.nnYou sound like a whiny little victim.

“…US banking system that conspired to allow millions of bad mortgages…” No, our federal government was responsible for this debacle by pushing unsound lending policies. The thousands of mortgage defaults and foreclosures in the u201csubprimeu201d housing market (i.e., mortgage holders with poor credit ratings) was the direct result of thirty years of government policy that forced banks to make bad loans to un-creditworthy borrowers. The crisis has its roots in the Community Reinvestment Act of 1977, a Carter-era law that purported to prevent u201credliningu201d – denying mortgages to minority borrowers – by pressuring banks to make home loans in u201clow- and moderate-income neighborhoods.u201d Under the act, banks were to be graded on their attentiveness to the u201ccredit needsu201d of u201cpredominantly minority neighborhoods.u201d The higher a banku2019s rating, the more likely that regulators would say yes when the bank sought to open a new branch or undertake a merger or acquisition. In 1995, as a result of interest from President Clintonu2019s administration, the implementing regulations for the CRA were strengthened by focusing the financial regulatorsu2019 attention on institutionsu2019 performance in helping to meet community credit needs. u201cFair lendingu201d essentially became synonymous with a universal lowering of credit standards u2014 and as lenders loosened credit standards, community groups cheered, and the White House lauded the commitment to u201cexpanding homeownership.u201d Legislatively, President Bush went so far as to propose eliminating down payment requirements altogether. In a September 2004 press statement, administration officials touted a so-called u201cZero-Downpayment Initiativeu201d that would eliminate the statutory requirement of a minimum three percent down payment for FHA-insured single-family mortgages for first-time homebuyers. Barney Frank, chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, rejected a Bush administration and Congressional Republican plan for regulating the mortgage industry in 2003, saying, “These two entities u2013 Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac u2013 are not facing any kind of financial crisis.”nThe economic meltdown started with the people in government u2014 including many who now are pushing for u201creformu201d u2014 who corrupted the credit practices of banks and other lenders in the name of progressive policies.nNo bad mortgage lending practices, no housing bubble. No bad mortgage lending practices, no economic meltdown. No bad mortgage lending practices, no bad bets on the housing markets. It was the bad mortgage lending practices, stupid.

lol…not one poster has blamed teachers for their own kids failing. Are you just doing your best to promote the liberal agenda?

Sure, what a great idea! Let’s exploit a talented athlete for a couple of years into slavery to then steal their salaries to pay down the national debt. Let’s figure out other professions we can do the same thing with too. I have no doubt your profession would be safe Vicks.nnBtw, wouldn’t that be called communism?

Because too many of these poor middle class people are wanting to suck off the government teet. They want a more bloated government than it already is……sad ignorance indeed!

@frankenbnHow ’bout you name a profession, any profession, wherein there are not more than a “few that are bad.”nThis is America where meritocracy went out of fashion well over a generation ago and the free market its very self is propped up by extensive and overwhelming taxpayer funding to multinational energy conglomerates, war profiteers, and corporate farming interests to name but three.nIn sum, your analysis is dreck and it is time you get out of the way, sir.

Heh? Schools are not simply baby sitters, not even socialization machines, though they do that too. The quality of tomorrows workers, thinkers and decision-makers are dependent on the quality of the education they get. And that means that not only do today’s school affect their future, it means it affects YOUR future. nSchools aren’t holding America hostage at the risk of teenage rampages. Schools are predictors of America’s total future, economic and otherwise.

Really???? First look at the root cause of the economic collapse, Clinton, as most Democrats do, left a SURPLUS when he left office. Then came W, the mouth piece, and now we have a rediculus DEFICT!! Next run away corporate greed, and removal of regulation created an economy balanced on pins. knock one out and down comes the house of cards the republicans created. Now I ask you how many of the wall street, corporate, and other CEO’s have been punished for this???? ZERO!!!!!!!! Instead the poor and middle class are being saddled with the republican agenda of PRIVITAZATION!!! Which does not cure anything!! It creates a “WALMART” economy. Low pay, no benefits, and if you try to organize to get better pay or benefits, they fire the organizer, or when they are “FORCED” to allow the orangizing, THEY CLOSE THE STORE.nBig business, and the republicans are they problem with this country, they are only intereted in more for them, and less for the poor and middle class. DEREGULATION CREATED THIS MESS. Now the republicans are trying to stimy the recovery, instead of fix it by blaming everyone by themselves and big busines. Open your eyes and see the facts, quit drinking the republican KOOL-AID!! Bag the TEA!!!

Really???? And where did you get your facts?? Wal-mart (the posterchild for republican reform)??? The teachers unions were willing to negotiate, with the state, and pay more for their benefits, and retirement. But that is not what Gov. Walker and the GOP want, their agenda is to destroy the middle class, and create a “WALMART” economy. Quit drinking the KOOL-AID, and look at how they are screwing you. And I am a republican, and I can not stand for these type of injustices, The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. nAnd the uproar that is being hear is the poor and middle class starting to say “ENOUGH IS ENOUGH” quit making us the pay all the burden. Quit giving big business, and the oil companies big tax cuts and taxing us more!!!

Thank you,David! Very well said!

I am completely against teachers unions. Not on the basis that teachers are overpaid or are somehow undeserving. But because I believe it is inherently wrong for taxpayers to contract with a group of people who use collective bargaining against them.nnWith that said, this guy gave a great speech.

“It takes a village to raise a child”…Teachers make up one part of that village and our village is huge. Teachers have no control over the first years of a child’s life or what goes on in that child’s home. Most do the best with the cards they are dealt with. Look at the classrooms in the public school system. These children are not all from well-to-do families. Some have severe learning disabilities and some have severe behavioral issues that were in existence well before they even came to school. Some are taking care of themselves at the ripe old age of six and are sometimes even taking care of their parents. Some come to school hungry, beaten, homeless, and tired. Some of them even come to school well dressed and fed but are ignored by those closest to them. Who are the other people in this village? They are the parents, the politicians, the clergy, the social workers, the little league coaches, the neighbors, the media, the doctors, the police, the lawyers, etc. Everyone plays a part in the upbringing of children in some way, shape or form. Teachers cannot control what children do or see outside of the classroom. They have become more than just teachers. They are now educators, mediators, counselors, parents, police, friends, judges and nurses. They are expected to be all these things because the rest of the “village” cannot be bothered. Instead, the village blames teachers for all of their short comings. Our world’s most important resources lie in our children and yet when the going gets tough, we blame teachers. In Canada, teachers are even blamed for winter storms when schools are canceled. It’s time to start working together instead of pointing the finger in one direction. Did anyone ever ask how a teacher becomes “lazy”? Perhaps it’s because he/she is simply burnt out!

The cry is always “We need to spend more on education, so we can attract the best teachers ! ” The problem is that the best teachers don’t always stay around. Thanks to unions making it next to impossible to remove under performing teachers (yes every profession has those who aren’t as capable as others) . During downturns in economy,some states must cut teachers from the payroll. The unions say that they can only layoff by seniority. I say that the taxpayers deserve the best teachers money can hire.

@ Chris Harris. I think it’s hilarious that “republicans” (neo-cons) like to throw around the word elite. Absolutely hilarious. Who is the party that’s sole purpose is to protect the wealth of the elite? You guys should try actually being true to some republican ideals instead of listening to the propaganda machine that hijacked your party.

Been teaching 25 years and felt that way all along. That said, I’ve also encountered a lot of respect from parents, friends and strangers along the way. The situation still needs work.

Be aware of RepubliCONs running around with NO college degree, NO formal teaching background, waiving UNVERIFIED budget spreadsheets and spewing public policy. They never been in a classroom with 32 kids beyond a day, let alone is QUALIFIED to teach a classroom, let alone QUALIFIED to criticize the teacher, the school, its principal, let alone QUALIFIED to comment on an entire school district or QUALIFIED to comment on the board of education of the state. But they are out there waiving the spreadsheet print out and spewing the policy in front of the podium.

I take exception to those who are accusing teachers of being lazy and “taking taxpayer money.” I am a Master degree level teacher with five years of full time teaching experience working with students with special needs. School budgets have kept me from staying in the same school for more than 2 years. Unions usually are not able to protect a teacher until they are tenured–which in different school systems happens after 3 or 5 years. Benefits for teachers are not always that great. We are paying high health insurance costs, and believe me, the school day never ends at 3:00. Most work days are closer to 10 or more hours of work, and most weekends are taken up with grading papers, planning and preparation. In Special Education, text books are usually not made available for the students’ varied abilities. Special ed. teachers are also responsible for keeping additional records for IEP’s as well as building worksheets and materials for each class they teach. In addition, working in low income schools means teachers buy paper, pencils, and any art or motivational materials for their own students. Income Tax forms allow a $250.00 deduction for teachers. That is a drop in the bucket. Teachers more likely spend upwards of 800.00 to 1000.00 a year. In one school where I worked,teachers had to supply copy paper to make _any_ copies for classroom use. nFYI: State Governments are trying to back out of their previous commitments to education and they are trying to transform the business of education into a business like a fast food franchise. nThey are no longer willing to hire experienced, well-educated teachers who would be the logical choice to move our students toward academic and employment success (even though kids are at risk and need expert help).nThey are instead opting to hire young, new graduates in order to pay them less. They are hoping to cap those salaries and add more hours –opting for longer school days and year around school for less pay and benefits. (They are attacking the Unions to take away their powers of giving teachers a voice and helping maintain benefits–And to weaken their political power.nMy sad prediction: The teachers will lose and the kids will lose.

I “make” more than most teachers, working in a manufacturing facility. I work hard and feel that I deserve what I “make”. Do I deserve to “make” more than most teachers? Hell NO! They may make less in many cases but, in almost all cases, teachers EARN much more than I ever will….

So true about parents doing their part!! Somehow we have forgotten that parents have a responsibility to teach their children as well. When did we decide that schools are responsible for raising our kids???n

Not trying to be antagonistic here sdpt45, but why are the teachers unions so set against holding teachers accountable? I’m all for rewarding great teaching but I’ve seen too many instances of unions protecting worthless teachers. Until they address this problem, I think teachers in general will continue to get a bad rap.

Everyone who has written a response here should watch the movie “Waiting for Superman” , a shocking documentary about the US (and by extension Canadian…we are not as different as we would like to believe) education system(s). It was released in October 2010 and should be available on DVD somewhere

As a husband of a marvelous teacher, I see both sides. Just like in any industry, business or sport, some teachers are indeed wonderful some are less than wonderful some a not so good and some are downright horrible. The problem exists in the fact that while in most businesses or sport you can weed out those unworthy of their position. You can not effectively do this in schools. We have been duped for a great many years by politicians on both sides of the proverbial isle into borrowing from our future. As communities we live like we have no worries or responsibilities regarding tomorrow. I am not going to enjoy the changing which are coming. I am going to suffer from the changes which are coming. At the same time, I am willing to take an honest look at our situation and realize that these changes are overdue. I do not for one minute blame teachers for our problems but they can not stand in the way of what is an unfortunate necessity to help toward the reparation of those problems. Good and great teachers will never have any problem making a good living from their profession. The lesser ones will need to improve themselves or change their line of work. The bad ones should simply go away and stop dragging down the system. As far as teaching itself is concerned and the performance of our children. It is without a doubt the product of our changing culture, the irresponsibility of parents and the notion of becoming as weak as the weakest link rather than exposing and eliminating the weakest link. Poor parenting trumps good teaching.

As a teacher in a modest middle class area in the state of Wisconsin, I would like to clarify a few points made regarding the teacher being the one to blame for the F. I have taught a chlld whose own father started her on fire. I have taught a child whose mother pimped her out out to get a free taxi ride. I have taught a child who was screaming for his life one night while a passenger in a car driven by a drunk parent. I have taught an 11 year old boy who stole his father’s crack and used it before school. The father’s only concern was that his kid stole from him. I have taught a student that was absent for 120 out of 180 school days. I have taught students whose parents have abandoned, abused, neglected and ignored them. How can we expect children to learn in school when they are trying to survive at home? As an educator, my job goes way beyond teaching academics. It is about teaching self worth when no one else will. So who really has failed these kids?

The issue is simple enough, if you believe teaching to be a haven for lazy individuals who do not have to work, then to me you sound jealous and should consider a career in education. All you need is an undergrad degree, education degree, and probably 2 or 3 years in the system as a supply teacher. So 8 easy, cheap years and you’re on your way. Probably a sweet deal considering you get summers off, and snow days, and everyone respects you. I’m Canadian, I have a union that protects my rights, I PAY for my pension, and all Canadians, myself included pay for my medical benefits. Maybe you fine folks should consider paying some more taxes yourself and then your once great nation could potentially stop the downward spiral into ridiculousness it seems so hell bent on maintaining. Get rid of teacher unions, go ahead. Teachers will stop becoming teachers, you’ll add to the already mounting number of school districts that desperately need teachers, and all your children will be in over crowed class rooms, with poor suckers that couldn’t get a job anywhere else meaning you might actually have to help your children with their calculus assignments. Good luck.

Who controlled the house and sentate during Clinton’s tenure? nnRepublicansnnWhat has Obama done with the deficit during his tenure?nnincreased it…by a HUGE amount.nnYou can play Dem vs Rep all you want but you may want to play with all of the facts.

SDtrader — WHO would choose to be a teacher for $30k per year?! Are these the folks that you want teaching your children (i.e., the future leaders and businesspeople of our country)?! nnYou’ve, SEVERAL TIMES, above stated the “take it or leave it” sentiment. We’re talking about the folks that are educating our children. Education, according economists and sociologists alike, is the most fundamental aspect of the modern economy.nnYou’re basically arguing that we should leave this in the hands of those who have no other choice… the dregs. Those who are willing to work for crap pay because they can’t get another job that pays better. That sounds like a great plan!nn(by the way, You have a really warped sense of the cost-of-living in Wisconsin or anywhere really…)

Ours would be a lot better if Obama hadn’t been stymied at every turn and allowed to his job. He wasted too much time trying get Republican consenus when all they’d do is be obstructionist.

I posted this above in thread, but I think a fresh post is useful.nnSDtrader — WHO would choose to be a teacher for $30k per year?! (after 5+ years of teaching experience AND 6+ years of post-secondary education) Are these the folks that you want teaching your children (i.e., the future leaders and businesspeople of our country)?!nnYou’ve, SEVERAL TIMES, stated above the “take it or leave it” sentiment. We’re talking about the folks that are educating our children. Education, according economists and sociologists alike, is the most fundamental aspect of the modern economy.nnYou’re basically arguing that we should leave this in the hands of those who have no other choice… the dregs. Those who are willing to work for crap pay because they can’t get another job that pays better. That sounds like a great plan!nn(by the way, You have a really warped sense of the cost-of-living in Wisconsin or anywhere really…)

As any thinking person knows, financial compensation for a job has little to do with social values. The issue with government-employment unions, including teachers unions, has mostly to do with the exclusion of taxpayers from the bargaining table. The problem is that elected officials do NOT represent the taxpayer at the bargaining table–they represent their elective interest and those who will vote in blocs to elect certain candidates over others. The average taxpayer who is not in a union is not represented by anyone is not part of a voting bloc that can make a difference in election in some localities.nnUnion campaign contributions and, let’s be frank about this, union intimidation are the 900-pound gorilla at the bargaining table.nnUnions have NO place in government work and government-related unions must ALL be banned & disbanded completely. Ours is a nation of, by and for the people–not of, by and for unions and their well-paid bosses.

I’m a member (not by choice) of a public sector union, but I’m of two minds about the role of unionization in the public workforce.nnHOWEVER — When it comes to education, who will (or really is currently) trying to make the argument that teachers should be better compensated to reflect their role in society… both in terms of social values AND purely economic terms. As I stated just before I read your comment, how do we expect to provide the education foundation for our future leaders and businesspeople if teaching is a completely unattractive profession? nnWhy should I want to become a teacher for $40k after years and years of education (and related debt), when I can probably make more as an apartment rental agent with no education? Or make a lot more with a 4-year degree in almost any other profession?nnLet’s set aside the union issue — But what about attracting the BEST of society to become teachers? It’s hard not to have schools filled with C-student *teachers* that scraped by in their education degrees if there’s no one else lining up to take their job!!

While rallying for what he says, I add that wish he could have role-modeled saying it more politely. But then it would have lacked the punch AND clearly he is too fed up to care much about politeness. But politeness is never a mistake, is it? Teachers make a huge difference in every life -for better AND for worse. May the force be with them.